Ross Jeffries - Mindframe Persuasion - Seminar Transcript (2009)

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript

Created By

Ross Jeffries

founder of Speed Seduction® Website: http://www.seduction.com

Learn From World-Renowned Persuasion, Influence And Speed Seduction® Master Ross Jeffries In The Comfort Of Your Own Home Copyright © 2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. This transcript may not be duplicated without written permission from the author.

Disclaimer I, Ross Jeffries, Ghita Services., Inc, and/or Seduction.com (or any of our other websites or entities) cannot and will not be held responsible in any way for your actions, and will not be held liable for any and all claims from you or any other third party. You alone are responsible for your decisions and actions, even if they have an impact on others. This information is meant for instructional purposes only. While this Mindframe Persuasion® seminar transcript contains information, tips, tools, and strategies that are recommended by us and, in most cases, have succeeded when applied by others, this product and its contents carry no warranty or guarantee (either explicit or implied) that the purchaser or reader will achieve success with business, or in any other endeavor for which they may be used.

Table of Contents Chapter 1 Intro to Mindframe Persuasion®............................................................................................ 1 Chapter 2 Willing Suspension of Disbelief .............................................................................................. 8 Chapter 3 Meta-States and Fractionation ............................................................................................ 15 Chapter 4 Mindframe Persuasion® Tools ............................................................................................. 22 Chapter 5 Parsing Vague Language ...................................................................................................... 30 Chapter 6 Stories and the Unconscious Mind ...................................................................................... 41 Chapter 7 Trance and Weasel Phrases ................................................................................................. 47 Chapter 8 Parsing More Vague Language............................................................................................. 53 Chapter 9 Non-Specific Time and Thought-Binding .............................................................................. 69 Chapter 10 Fundamental Building Blocks of Reality ............................................................................. 84 Chapter 11 Being Artfully Vague and Establishing Authority ............................................................... 92 Chapter 12 Metaphors ......................................................................................................................... 99 Chapter 13 Four Methods for Establishing Authority (Drill Exercise) ................................................. 116 Chapter 14 Drills on Being Artfully Vague .......................................................................................... 123 Chapter 15 Ideal Candidate Patterns ................................................................................................. 127 Chapter 16 Operating System and Machine Language of Persuasion ................................................ 140 Chapter 17 Pseudo-Orientation in Time ............................................................................................. 145 Chapter 18 Scope Ambiguity and RJ’s Metaphors .............................................................................. 159 Chapter 19 Summary, Hypnotic Trance, and Conclusion .................................................................... 171 Workshops.......................................................................................................................................... 178 Darren................................................................................................................................................. 179 Yoav .................................................................................................................................................... 211 Paul..................................................................................................................................................... 267

Chapter 1: Intro to Mindframe Persuasion® Ross:

What do you sell? You never sell a product. You always sell wants and needs, and most importantly, trust and decisions. I‟m a hypnotist. I‟ve been doing hypnosis over 20 years. Someone once said to me, “Can you make people do things against their will?” I said, “No, but the reality is that most people don‟t have a will.” If you define “will” as a strong determined focus that does not waver, most people have never even gotten close to having a will. Most people at best have whims that come and go. This is important. Who here does not believe that they‟re a salesperson? You‟re always selling something. You‟re selling feelings, decisions or actions that you want people to take in one form or another. People‟s decisions and the emotions that they‟re based on are such that they tend to waver. Are you going to make people do things against their will? Most people don‟t have a will. You, as a salesperson or persuader or any kind, need to understand that 95% of the people in the world don‟t know when they‟ve made a good decision. Part of your job as a persuader is not only to get them to make that decision but to condition the decision-making process in such a way that they feel good about the decision that they‟ve made. Amateurs can‟t persuade anyone to do anything. People with skill persuade people to do things. People with great skill persuade people to do things in such as way that the people believe it‟s a really good idea and that it‟s their idea. 1

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

They condition the person on how they should feel about making the decision. They manage the person‟s investment in the decisionmaking process such that when the person looks back on the decision and feels, “Oh, my god, this was my idea! I‟m so glad I did it.” I want to suggest that our job, as Mindframe® persuaders, is multifold. It‟s not enough to create a really good persuasion that convinces people to do things. You first have another job of convincing. Your first job is to convince people that you‟re someone worthwhile to listen to, to create a filter through which they look at you. That filter must contain the right emotions you want them to look at you through. You need to control the meaning that people give to the transaction. What if, rather than people interpreting what you do as trying to sell them, they viewed that the very activity of listening to you or reading your sales letter was, in and of itself, a very valuable, worthwhile activity being conducted as part of a shared, high value experience being led by a trusted authority and friend? Wouldn‟t that be pretty cool? How many people here have a sales presentation in written form that they want to work with me on, like a web page or a sales letter? How many people are interested in persuading a person through something they say in person, face to face? How many people are interested in persuading through electronic media? What are the kinds of emotions that we want our audience, in whatever form they come, to view our presentation through? 2 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Trust.

Participant:

Openness.

Ross:

I like that. What exactly do you mean by “openness”?

Participant:

You‟re open to new ideas. You‟re open to life.

Participant:

Excitement.

Participant:

Inspiration.

Participant:

Suspension of disbelief.

Participant:

Believability.

Ross:

What does that mean?

Participant:

Trust. They have some confidence in what you‟re saying.

Participant:

Curiosity.

Participant:

Interest.

Participant:

I can‟t think of a single word for it, but they need to feel good about telling their friends and family. If someone is buying something, they‟ve got to feel confident that they can tell people.

Ross:

I would not say that that‟s the initial filter you want. Let‟s make a clear distinction with basic needs that people want fulfilled. People want more money, sex, status and popularity. That‟s all great to aim at within the body of your presentation, but in the beginning, that‟s not what you want in their mind.

Alex:

You need to be the expert. 3

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s good. They‟re looking at you as an expert in their world. We‟re going to get to that. I want to suggest something else. Here‟s the challenge. It used to be that all you had to do was make a really good presentation where you convinced people that you were correct, that the benefit of your product outweighed the cost, that they should get it, and make a good offer. You still have to do that, but it‟s not enough. Nowadays, your prospect, particularly if you‟re selling a commercial thing, is suffering from some syndromes. They‟re suffering from what I call MADD: Marketing Attention Deficit Disorder. What do I mean by marketing attention deficit disorder? Your prospect has been bombarded by so many marketing messages that they just turn off and don‟t pay attention anymore. How many marketing messages would you say you‟ve been exposed to in the past seven days? Thousands, right? Anyone on the internet? These messages come through different formats like email, TV and even popular music. We‟re constantly being bombarded. Some people just turn off. The other problem people have is that they‟re on overload. With the economy being in the toilet, you have to run twice as fast to get half as far, so people are on overload. People are stressed. People don‟t trust. There are different ways that people don‟t trust. First, they don‟t trust that you‟re someone worth listening to. The second way that mistrust manifests is that they don‟t trust that you happen to have the answer to their particular challenge. Then they don‟t trust that anyone has an answer to that area of life. 4

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

They may say, “This is just the way it is. No one can solve this problem. You just can‟t learn to charm women intentionally. You can‟t make money. You can‟t look younger.” The final, and most insidious way, in which people don‟t trust is that even if they trust that you have an answer, you‟re going to deliver that answer, and that there is an answer, they may just think that it can‟t work for them. They may not trust their own ability to make it work. Typically, people have viruses in their head. I don‟t mean real, physical viruses. They have what I call neuro-linguistic viruses. You‟re going to encounter this. You need to understand this. Typically, they take the form of “That‟s just the way I am.” Whenever you hear the words, “that‟s just” or “it‟s just,” be on alert because people are about to give you a mind virus. They‟re about to excuse or make a justification for their stuckness. You‟ll hear things like, “It‟s just the way I am,” “It‟s just not the way I am,” “That‟s just me,” or, “It‟s just not me. Have you heard these things before? Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

Have you ever heard yourself say it to yourself?

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

The other one I really can‟t stand is really big if you‟re selling something. “It‟s too good to be true.” Think about that. Parse that out. When someone says, “It‟s too good to be true,” aren‟t they really saying that the only thing that‟s real is limitation and lack? 5

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

I wouldn‟t be so sure that‟s right. Some things are too good to be true.

Ross:

Really?

Participant:

If I had a time machine, I could take you back in the past, and you could see your dead grandma. That‟s an extreme example, like “The Twilight Zone.”

Ross:

Within the realm of physical law, when it comes to getting other people to do things that they are physically capable of doing, it‟s very unlikely. As someone who has dated women who otherwise would be way out of my league, it‟s never too good to be true. Look at my face. Charitably speaking, I‟m not the best-looking guy in the world, but my girlfriend is Swedish and looks like a combination of Jessica Biel and Scarlet Johansson. She‟s 20 years old. If I can do that, it‟s never too good to be true. The final thing is that nowadays, people don‟t trust any kind of institution or authority. Think about it. Not this year, but the year before, just before I filed my income taxes, my accountant said, “Open an IRA or SEP IRA, and you can deduct it from your taxes. You have until April 15.” This story is absolutely true. It‟s hilariously funny because it‟s so true. This was 2008. I ran in to Washington Mutual April 12. I said, “I want to open a _____.” He said, “What level of risk do you want to take?” I said, “I want something extremely conservative.” He said, “I‟ve got something from a company called AIG.” I‟m not making this up. I swear this is true. I said, “AIG? Who are they? Tell 6

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

me about them.” He said, “They have assets like you wouldn‟t believe.” I probably shouldn‟t have believed it. Think about this. Our most trusted institutions have melted. People don‟t believe anything. Remember the old phrase, “Don‟t worry about it. You can take that to the bank”? Listen to metaphors. The metaphors that are common in your society are something you can really tap into, if they‟re still true. If they‟re not true, you‟d better not tap into them. “You can take that to the bank.” “He laughs all the way to the bank.” The only ones laughing all the way to the bank are the executives who are taking those fat bonuses and our tax dollars to keep their banks running. You‟ve to be aware of these tremendous filters of skepticism, not believing anyone, and not believing in themselves. You have to work to get those filters set aside and create a filter.

7 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 2: Willing Suspension of Disbelief I want to introduce a concept to you. The concept is called a “willing suspension of disbelief.” What do I mean? Has anyone ever heard of this concept before? Adam:

It‟s like when you‟re watching a sitcom, and they do weird things, like Steve Urkel has a machine that turns him into Steve Urkel. You‟re supposed to believe it like it‟s true.

Ross:

Only you would use an example of Urkel. A willing suspension of disbelief is something a little more subtle than that. How many people here have ever fallen in love or thought they were in love? That‟s a willing suspension of disbelief. When you‟re in love, don‟t you think that your partner is the most attractive person in the whole world, and everything they do is wonderful? You think you‟re going to be together forever, and it was meant to be. Every person who has ever been divorced and devastated believed that at one time. I‟m not attacking the institution of matrimony. Love is an example of a willing suspension of disbelief. You take your critical faculty and throw it on the bedroom floor. Have you ever known someone who was in love with a real loser? You try to tell that person, “What are you doing with that other person? Can‟t you see that they‟re unemployed?” What kinds of things do you hear?

Participant:

“No, it‟s not true.”

Ross:

“You don‟t really know them the way I know them.” 8

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

How many people here have ever believed the promises of a politician? Have you ever seen the old Charlie Brown cartoons where Lucy would hold the football? Every time Charlie Brown went to kick the football, she would pull it away, and he would fall on his ass, but Charlie Brown always believed it when Lucy promised, “No, I won‟t do it this time.” He always believed, “Yes, I can believe that she‟s being honest this time.” If you‟ve ever voted for a politician and really believed that they were going to change the world, it was a willing suspension of disbelief. How many people have ever been to the movies? The willing suspension of disbelief there is that when the movie starts, you have to suspend your knowledge that you‟re sitting in a theater. You have to forget that there are people surrounding you, that there are four walls and that you‟re in a room shared with other people. You need to hallucinate that all away to believe the presentation that you‟re watching completely. Did anybody catch that ambiguity? Did anyone not catch it? Not consciously. What did I say? In order to enjoy a movie, you have to hallucinate away the walls and everything else and really tune in to the presentation and believe that everything you‟re watching is true. I‟m giving you a command. “Believe that everything you‟re watching in the presentation is true.” We‟ll teach you how to use embedded

9 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

commands and embedded suggestions. That will be part of the training. Willing suspension of disbelief is something that takes place all the time. What if you could, on some level if not completely, get your client, prospect or subject to willingly suspend their disbelief and enter into a childlike state of wanting to be convinced and believe what you have to say? Would it not be advantageous to then have them view or listen to the presentation or read your sales letters through that filter? Furthermore, what if you could change the meaning they gave to it, rather than meaning they‟re being sold? This, in itself, is a valuable act. Listening to this talk in itself is a value, regardless of whether or not you buy what it is that I‟m selling. I‟m leaning on it there. Would that be useful? How many people have to persuade in a professional setting, like from the stage, persuade a jury, or persuade people in an audience? Would this be useful when you‟re looking to get employed? Oh, yes! You want to create a willing suspension of disbelief. You want people to assign the meaning of the transaction, not as that they‟re being sold but that they‟re participating in an activity that in and of itself has value. You want them to run through the chain of emotions that you would like them to experience your presentation through. Periodically,

10 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

from time to time, you want to return to those things, so you reinforce them. Finally, throughout the persuasion, you want to do little things to manage their emotional investment in the persuasion, such that they feel good about it. I‟m overloading you with concepts. This first evening is about concepts. During the workshop part coming up Saturday and Sunday, I will unpack these concepts, and you will see them being demonstrated in action. From time to time, I will stop and unpack it for all of you. I will say, “Look what I‟m doing here. Do you understand?” If I‟m going very fast, it‟s part of how I teach in the beginning to overload and really excite your imaginations. As you find that happening, you can recognize, “Wait a minute. That‟s the process of getting excited about something you‟re learning of fantastic value.” Again, did I say what the fantastic value is? No. You have to come up with it on your own. One thing you‟ll notice is that when I offer a suggestion, I do a slight head nod. For those of you who are selling things in person, you‟ll want to teach your staff to do that little head nod. I‟m exaggerating so you can see it. There is something called mirror neurons. People tend to mirror the very small pieces of behavior. Has anyone here taken NLP training where they teach you to cross your legs when the other person crosses their legs? People tend not to mirror big movements. They filter them out or overload, but they‟ll mirror small movements. 11 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

This happens to be far more effective than this. When you do this, you‟re actually locking in to the mirror neurons of the other person. Typically if they‟re in any way open, you‟ll see that nod back. It‟s the unconscious nod. It‟s a micro-expression of a nod. Have you ever heard this thing about the „Yes Ladder‟? Who here has taken a traditional sales training? Have you ever heard about the Yes Ladder? Sir, are you here today to learn? Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

You are interested in investing in learning, are you not?

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

The „Yes Ladder‟. The „Yes Ladder‟ has been done to pieces. However if you do this and get people unconsciously nodding with you, it‟s an internal „Yes Ladder‟ that they‟re not even aware is going on. Is it fair to be using techniques of hypnotic persuasion on your prospect?

Participant:

Absolutely.

Ross:

Can you say, “Hell, yes”?

Participant:

Hell, yes!

Ross:

Of course it is. I want you all to promise. Raise your hand and say, “I promise not to misuse these techniques to get people to be my mind slave and send me tons of money.” 12

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

I promise not to misuse these techniques to get people to be my mind slave and send me tons of money.

Ross:

I enjoy my job. There are little things I will show you throughout. This is a really key thing. I‟m going to diagram something. I want you to really get this distinction. This is key, not just in terms of business but in personal relationships. In personal relationships, this is incredibly powerful and really key. I‟m giving you things that are like nuclear weapons in your arsenal, so use them with discretion, but use them. Someone who is clueless has no ability to capture and lead the imagination or persuade. Clueless people do not know how to induce emotional states and create subjective filters in the minds of the audience such that the audience will look with absolute gullibility, suggestibility and childlike belief. The talented person knows how to create these emotional states. I want to make sure you really get this. This is really important. When you get this concept, it will open up an entire world of power for you, and I‟m not joking. I‟m being completely down to the ground, non-exaggerating. I‟m not going to do any jokes or funny lines here because this is serious. When you get this next distinction, it will open up a world for you. Here‟s the distinction. People who have mastery with persuasion can not only engender these emotional states and get people to look at them through these emotional filters, but they can manage how the prospect interprets these emotions states, what actions they should take from them, and the meaning that they give feeling those emotions. 13

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Just because you‟re getting someone to feel certain emotions and be in a certain emotional state doesn‟t mean that they will interpret it in such a way that they take the actions you want them to take. Sometimes they will, and sometimes they won‟t.

14 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 3: Meta-states and Fractionation What you need to do is to get the other person invested in these emotions and train their unconscious mind to continue to invest in those emotions and what actions to take from those emotions. I‟m going to introduce an advanced concept to you, and I want you to ask questions because I find it difficult to believe that you will understand this thoroughly the first time I say it. It‟s a concept called meta-states. Here, I do want you to take notes. I want you to write down the word, “meta-state.” I‟m going to teach you two concepts right now. I‟m going to teach you meta-states and fractionation. If you understand these concepts, your ability to persuade people into action will be very nearly effortless and extraordinary. Master persuaders do this stuff but often don‟t know that they‟re doing it. Many people do these things unconsciously when they‟re really good. I want to unpack it and put it under your conscious control so you understand what you are doing. When you do this, you will get so good that not only can you persuade people, but you will see the milestones throughout the persuasion. You will see the process working, so you can track what‟s going on. You will know, “Here‟s where they‟re at. Here‟s what I need to do next.” The sales will fall off your eyes. You will see the matrix. I promise you.

15 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I‟m being completely serious. By the end of this weekend, if you follow my directions and do as I say—I‟m stepping on it—you will be able to do this stuff. It‟s really cool. One of the metaphors I like to give is puppets on a string. Most people are walking around like puppets on a string. They‟re pulling their own strings, or other people are pulling their strings. I‟m going to teach you to see the strings. I‟m going to teach you to cut the strings that don‟t serve you, create the strings that do, and make beautiful music as you tug on them. Am I painting a good picture? What do I mean by “meta-states”? The notion is that human consciousness is constantly reflecting back on itself. Have you ever been in a state where you felt joyous and happy? Some of you have to reach back in your memory, but it‟s there. I‟m willing to bet that that primary state of feeling joyous didn‟t particularly last that long, or it wasn‟t actually a clean state of joy. I‟m willing to bet that from time to time, you experienced gratitude about your joy or fulfillment. From time to time, you popped out of the primary state of joy and reflected on it in some way. Maybe you reflected on it in the following fashion. “Wow, I sure hope this lasts longer. I sure hope this lasts all day.” Maybe you reflected on it from some doubt. “I wonder how long this is going to last.” Is this correct? Is this matching your experience? Maybe you‟ve been really angry. You were really pumped up. Have you ever done something stupid in traffic, like road rage? The next day, you thought, “Oh, my god, why did I do that?” You reflected on it from a different perspective. 16 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

People are constantly popping in and out of a primary state. A primary state is a state that has a lot of emotional charge. You feel it in your body. When you‟re really angry and shaking with rage, that‟s a primary state, or when you‟re really attracted to someone. A meta-state is a more cerebral state. It‟s a state of reflection upon the primary state. Throughout any persuasion, if you do it artfully, people will be in certain primary states, but they‟re also going to be popping out and reflecting on that primary state. Your job is not just to create the primary state but to control what type of meta-state they get into when they reflect on the primary state. Do they reflect on their primary emotions of excitement, wanting to act now and desire with skepticism and doubt or a state of enthusiasm about their excitement and believing in their excitement? You can actually train people‟s unconsciousness minds, outside of their conscious awareness, in such a way that you can control how they reflect on the primary state. I don‟t like the word “closing.” It implies shutting down. When you can do that, your opening-of-theirwallet ratios will go way up. There‟s a concept in hypnosis called fractionation. I‟m going to explain this very briefly. Fractionation is a phenomenon in hypnosis. If I took someone up here, put them on that seat and hypnotized them very deeply into trance, and just told them to keep going deeper and deeper, there‟s only so far they could go, even if they wanted to cooperate and experience trance. However, if I were to put someone in trance in that chair and bring them back up, put them back down, and bring them back up, each 17 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

time they went down, they would go down just a little bit deeper. They could feel themselves going just a little bit deeper down into the state because every time you bring them up and put them back down, they would go in with a bit more comfort, ability and ease. Fractionation is the process of actually getting someone into a primary state, pulling them out then getting them back into the primary state. Every time they go back into the primary state, they go back in even stronger. I mean no insult to the ladies in the audience. I love women. My sisters are very powerful, brilliant women. Her mom is my sister, and she is brilliant and powerful. His mom is my other sister, who is brilliant and powerful. I genuinely respect women as my equals. Romantically, gentlemen, women run on fractionation. Fractionation is the machine language and the operating system of women. I‟ll tell you this phenomenon. A woman is really into a guy. She falls in love with him. It‟s very unlikely that she‟s going to continue to feel that love. She will pop out and say, “Is he really the one? I wonder if I‟m really ready for a relationship. What do my girlfriends think?” She‟s constantly popping herself in and out of the primary state. If you don‟t recognize it and manage it, you‟re going to have a lot of trouble. Women want to feel good, strong, positive emotions. So do men. We all do. We‟re human. We want to feel good. That‟s not an insult to anyone to say that. It‟s recognizing that we‟re human.

18 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

If you don‟t fractionate a woman, she will fractionate herself because unconsciously, she knows that that is how she increases the good feelings. She may fractionate herself destructively through creating drama. The reason she‟s pushing you and those emotions away is because she knows unconsciously that when they come back, they‟ll come back even stronger. Many of your prospects will behave the same way. They will take their good feeling about what they‟re reading or listening to and push it away because unconsciously, they know that that‟s the way to feel even better about it. About half the people will do this, and you need to learn to recognize that because then you can manage it. Has anyone ever heard of these concepts before or considered these concepts? This is the deep operating system of how this stuff works. I‟m going to give to the surface level tools too, the down-tothe-ground stuff that gets in their face, but it is really important to understand how it works. AJ:

Can you give a good example of that in a sales scenario?

Ross:

There are several different levels upon which you can fractionate people. One way you can fractionate, and should fractionate, is going back and forth between being vague and being specific because the mind really likes that. One clue when you persuade is that you should almost always start by being vague then move to the specific.

19 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

For example, I say, “When you feel a great deal of trust for someone and find your mind opening in a way where you get really curious, speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, I just want to let you know that this weekend, I‟m going to be covering six different topics, every one of which I think you‟ll find interesting for your own reasons. Here are the topics I‟m going to be covering.” If I then list the topics and tell you what they are specifically, and end it all by saying, “Now, isn‟t it interesting how you can find your own reasons to get really excited about that?” what did I just do? I started vague, and you thought, “Oh, he understands me. He‟s describing what I really want,” when in reality, I‟m letting you fill in the blanks. Then I give you the specifics. Now you‟re looking at those specifics through the filter of “He really understands me.” Then I end by being vague again by saying, “As that‟s happening, I think you can agree that that‟s the process of opening your mind to something really amazing.” Participant:

Very cool.

Ross:

One of the primary things I do in any kind of presentation is to start with the vague, give specific, then go back to vague to close. There is one caveat. Listen up. When you go to the close, the call to action, you have to go specific. You can‟t say, “As you find yourself deciding how you want to order, I‟ll be waiting for you to do that.” You have to tell them, “Pick up the phone. Dial this.” Bear in mind that throughout the weekend as I actually work with people, you will be seeing these tools again and again. I will stop to 20

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

identify the tools. My purpose for the next hour is to go through some of them and give you some quick examples. Then we will continue to return to them throughout the weekend as we work together. We‟ve gone through a few pages already. Let‟s skip to Page 5 of the notes, “Part 3: The Tools of MindFrame Persuasion®.” I‟m going to make this very clear. Even though I‟m introducing the tools in a certain order, it does not mean that the tools are used in any particular chronological order. Whenever I teach my Speed Seduction® course in Europe, invariably, the German students say, “What number is this?” They always want to know the exact order that they‟ll use things in. Is there really a sequence? The numbering here is done to keep track, but there‟s not really any such thing. Let‟s look at the first one. These are really good. No one else in the persuasion community teaches these tools.

21 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 4: Mindframe Persuasion® Tools 1. Implied togetherness words. Remember, what we‟re seeking to do is to create a filter or frame of an implied relationship or trust and caring. Look at these: teacher/student,

leader/follower,

guide/explorer.

It‟s

not

salesperson/customer. We don‟t want people to put that meaning on it. Instead, we want them to look at it as teacher/student, leader/follower or guide/explorer in a shared and valuable activity. Let‟s talk about these implied togetherness words. Why do I say “implied”? What is the purpose of implying something rather than directly stating it? Participant:

Less objection.

Participant:

Less resistance.

Ross:

What if I walked up to you and said, “What I‟m about to do is not a sale. Rather, I would like you to look at me as a trusted guide leading you on a journey of discovery so you will believe that what I‟m saying is true”?

Participant:

Get out of here.

Ross:

Instead, we want to use implication. Implication is one of the most powerful principles. All of the tools that allow you to imply are incredibly powerful. Again, I have to bring up the area of romance. Gentlemen, do women use implication with us? Do they ever imply things rather than say them directly? 22

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

Have you ever heard a woman say to you, “It‟s going to be an early evening”? What is she implying?

Participant:

No sex.

Ross:

Or she may be implying, “Let‟s get it over with quickly because I need to get some sleep.” That‟s my interpretation. What other kinds of implications do we hear? People use implications all the time. They imply things rather than say them directly.

Participant:

Not just verbally.

Ross:

You can imply nonverbal things, but we‟re talking about verbal things. If I say, “Let‟s join together as we continue to explore this exciting world of persuasion in a way where we recognize this is something we really want to do,” what does that imply? If I say, “Let‟s join together,” what does that imply? If I say, “Join with me as we explore this world of persuasion,” what does that imply?

Participant:

A relationship.

Ross:

A shared activity, not something that I‟m doing to you or trying to get you to do.

Scott:

When your lady friend tells you, “Don‟t you think the garbage smells?” she‟s actually telling you to take out the garbage.

23 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

If I say, “Why don‟t we join together in this exploration of what persuasion can do for you in a way where you feel great about it,” what am I implying about the relationship between us?

Participant:

We‟re both doing it, not just you.

Ross:

I imply that it‟s something we‟re cooperating in doing, not something that I‟m inflicting on you. I‟ll show you how these blend together. Examples of implied togetherness words are “let‟s,” “let us,” “we,” and “why don‟t we.” “Why don‟t we talk about this? Why don‟t we explore together just what it is you would like to discover from me today?” “It occurs to me to say to you why don‟t we explore just exactly how you can benefit from what it is you‟d like to gain today.” 2. Long/joined words and phrases. These are really good. Tomorrow or Sunday, I‟m going to bring an example of a sales letter that uses this. It‟s so good. I first read the sales letter 12 years ago. I still keep a copy around. Let‟s look at these. “Follow along,” “tag along,” “Join along,” “come along,” “join in,” “join with me.” “Warning: Don‟t flick that switch until you learn how your lights may be destroying your mind, scrambling your brains, and destroying your health. Dear friend who‟s concerned with your health and the health of those you love. The story of how your lighting may be the most dangerous thing in your environment is an interesting one that many people would really like to hear. Follow along as I uncover the shocking secrets of _____.”

24 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I‟m just spinning this off the top of my head without even writing anything. I say, “follow along” or “read along.” This is really clever. I‟ve never even met you. You‟re sitting there 10,000 miles away. You‟re going along, and the sales letter says, “Read along,” or “Tag along as I uncover the shocking secret of _____.” Participant:

Do you imply that you‟re also an authority?

Ross:

Do you follow someone who‟s not an authority?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

Look at this phrase, “follow along.” What does “follow along” imply? There are several implications. First, if you follow, who‟s the leader and who‟s the person being led? If I say, “follow along,” and you buy into that, who‟s the one with the power?

Participant:

You are.

Ross:

That‟s right, but I don‟t say it. Generally speaking, if you‟re the follower, do followers question what the leader says?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

Can you be a follower and look at the leader through a filter of disbelief and skepticism and thinking, “I don‟t believe a word he says”?

Participant:

You can.

Ross:

But then you‟re not really, truly a follower. If you buy in to me saying, “follow along,” what does it imply about the power dynamic in the relationship? I have the power. What does it imply about the nature of the relationship? There is a 25

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

relationship of trust. What does it say about the emotional filter through which you have to view me and the message? The message is worthwhile, valuable and trustworthy. Look at this one. This one is really sick in a good way. “Tag along.” If I say, “Tag along as I explain to you the true secrets of how your health is being jeopardized by _____,” what is the emotional connotation of tagging along? How old are you if you‟re tagging along? Participant:

Twelve.

Participant:

It‟s playful.

Participant:

Young.

Ross:

The suggestion is to age regress yourself to a childlike state in your mind as you receive my message. I‟m not saying that it‟s going to be something really powerful. It‟s a subtle thing. But if you repeat these suggestions occasionally in a chain of suggestions, each suggestion builds on the other one. The principle here is called the Law of Compound Suggestion. The way the Law of Compound Suggestion works in hypnosis, for those of you who are interested in the hypnotic aspect, is that each suggestion you give builds upon and reinforces the next suggestion. Each suggestion is supported by the suggestion that preceded it, and it supports the suggestion that goes after it. If throughout the progression of the sales letter or talk I‟m sprinkling this in and returning to it, it builds over time. I‟m not saying that by 26

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

saying “tag along” the person is going to go into a deep trance and age regress, although they might. Participant:

Is that the same as fractionation?

Ross:

In what sense?

Participant:

You give reason after reason.

Ross:

That‟s more recursion. Hold that thought. “Join along,” “follow along,” “read along,” “join in,” “come along.” In your presentations and sales letters, begin very early on, within the first paragraph, to use this languaging, and you‟ll see a marked improvement in what you do.

Nathaniel:

How do I avoid condescension or patronizing? Let‟s say I‟m talking to someone 50 years old. I say “tag along.” Instead of the possibility of child-like regression, they might think, “This guy is being condescending with me.”

Ross:

First, I encourage you to discover in the world how people will actually respond rather than speculating about it. Give yourself permission to see it in the world, and let the world and actual experience inform you what works. What I‟ve seen again and again as a Speed Seduction® teacher is that students say, “I can‟t talk that way to a woman. A woman would never buy into that. A woman would never like that,” when in fact they‟re just blocking themselves. In reality, if they would just do the experiment, it would work. Second, it‟s a very subtle thing. It‟s not something you‟re going to lean on. If you‟re concerned, and I understand the concern, then 27

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

just say “join along,” “come along,” “join in,” or “follow along.” If the word “tag” bothers you, don‟t use it. Participant:

What would be the reason for them to follow along?

Ross:

The headline or the initial part of the presentation captures their attention. You‟ve got to start with some kind of headline that really gets their attention.

Participant:

We can‟t just say, “That‟s another story. Next.”

Ross:

This is the way I do it. 3. Valuable activity verbs. These verbs, if you use them, imply that you are engaging in a valuable activity with them and set the frame or meaning that they‟re not being sold. These are words like “discover,” “uncover,” “explore,” or “learn.” “As we discover the reasons why this is a powerful opportunity, I just want to tell you that I‟m incredibly excited about assisting people to explore the things that they really want to do.” I‟m just making this up on the spot. 4. Implied value nouns. These are similar to verbs. You just change how they look. If I say, “I‟m going to share a discovery,” “discovery” is a word that has a positive emotional charge to it as opposed to a sale. “Secret” is overused, but “secret” still has a good emotional charge. “Breakthrough” has a strong emotional charge.

28 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“Journey.” “As we continue in this journey of discovery about just what makes you a powerful persuader as you follow these principles, I‟m not sure exactly what questions will come to your mind as part of the process is getting involved in your own learning, but as that‟s happening, I want you to know that I encourage that, so feel free to ask questions.” Read it with me. What‟s the next one after “journey”? Participant:

Exploration.

Ross:

Does “exploration” have a strong positive emotional connotation?

Participant:

Yes.

Participant:

It‟s a valuable activity.

Ross:

“Learning.” Who would confess that they‟re not interested in learning in public? No one wants to believe that about themselves, even the person who spends their whole life in front of the TV. “Adventure.” You want to be careful not to overuse these. People think, “Come on. Adventure? From a cart that‟s selling me creams?” Someone here does that business. I‟ve gone to those carts. I rather like flirting with those girls. You ought to watch my students. My students can use a captive audience.

29 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 5 Parsing Vague Language Let me show you some examples. In fact, let‟s read them together. Participant:

I think we will really enjoy as we uncover this world of persuasion mastery today.

Ross:

Let‟s parse that out. “I think we will really enjoy.” I think we will really enjoy what? Am I saying what we will really enjoy?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

Am I saying in what way we‟ll really enjoy it?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

This is an example of being vague. The mistaken way of saying it is, “I think we will really enjoy the specificity of what I‟m teaching as we uncover the following things: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6.” This is all vague. Uncover how? What are we going to uncover? I don‟t tell you, do I? You have to fill in the blanks and become curious. For many of you, your single biggest error as persuaders is this. I‟ll give you the secret right now: You‟re being too specific too soon. One of the principles I forgot to mention is that you want to establish that you‟re an authority in the world of the other person. Here‟s a note. It‟s a very powerful principle of persuasion. I‟ll explain it, and then you can write it down word for word. This principle has made me a lot of money. 30

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

People will not accept that you‟re an authority on where they should go or what they should do unless they first accept that you‟re an authority or expert on where they are at. If you want people to accept that you‟re an authority on where they should go, you must first demonstrate that you understand where they are at. This is a key distinction. As a very good teacher, I need to catch you here before you make this error. I did not say that you have to go where the other person is at. I did not say you have to feel what they‟re feeling. If you can gain this ability, your personal relationships will improve, as well as your business. The ability to see and understand where the other person is at without having to go there for yourself is a profoundly powerful ability. When you‟re doing a presentation or any kind of sales or persuasion, it‟s important to know what the fears, failures and frustrations of your audience are, as well as the three D‟s - their dreams, sense of destiny, and desires. We‟ll get to all of this. So, here‟s the rule. If you want a person or persons to accept that you‟re an authority on where they should go, you must first demonstrate or convince them that you‟re an authority on where they are at. You must demonstrate that you understand needs, wants, fears, failures, frustrations, dreams, destiny and desires. These are the things that when you study your market, you have to ask yourself. “What are those? Who is my ideal market?” If you‟re 31 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

doing a negotiation, your market is the person you‟re negotiating with. You really have to ask those questions of yourself first and foremost. By the way, a big thing for you is for you to get clear on who your best customer is. Who is your ideal customer? I‟m not asking that now, but I mean in terms of getting actual numbers, getting demographics so you can measure and map out, “This person, of this gender, this age, and this income is my ideal customer.” That‟s who you want to aim at. A lot of the challenges in your business are what I would call wastage, putting effort into people who are just not worth the time and money to attempt to sell. That‟s a parenthetical aside. Let‟s look at another example. I‟m going to parse it through with you. I love this stuff, by the way. I can blabber this vague stuff until the cows come home. “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries that radically transform lives for the better. So I thank you for allowing me to uncover this for you today.” Let‟s have a look at this. “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries.” What are the presuppositions and implications of that? Participant:

You know something that they don‟t.

Ross:

I know something that they don‟t, and what I‟m doing is not selling but another “S” word: sharing. Does that word have powerful emotional implications?

32 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

By the way, you notice I‟m sliding it in through so much vague language that people don‟t have time to stop and say, “Sharing? Wait a minute. This isn‟t a share. It‟s a sale.” I‟m surrounding it by so much more vague language they don‟t have time to get critical or skeptical about it. It slides right in. You just got it. The light just went on powerfully in your mind. Didn‟t it? Participant:

I resonated with that, yes.

Ross:

If I said instead, “Today I‟ll be sharing exciting discoveries,” notice your mental and emotional response to that as opposed to, “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries.” I‟m not saying, “Today I‟m sharing discoveries,” am I? I‟m saying, “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries.” What I‟m distracting your attention to is how excited I am. Because you‟re paying attention to that, the part saying that I‟m sharing with you slides right past your critical resistance. If I phrased it, “Today I‟m going to be sharing discoveries that really excite me,” it‟s not the same. If I say, “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries,” in order to understand that sentence, you have to accept the presupposition that I‟m sharing, and I‟m sharing discoveries. It‟s really clever. “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries.” What discoveries? It‟s vague. Because it‟s vague, what?

Participant:

You imagine what you want.

Ross:

You fill in the blanks in a way that makes sense for you. 33

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“I just want to let you know.” Who? It‟s not about what I‟m about to tell you, it‟s about “I want to let you know.” It‟s a matter of fact. That implies that what I‟m about to tell you is a fact that you do not question. “Before we begin this journey into the world of persuasion mastery.” What kind of persuasion mastery? In what sense? Persuading people to do what? How? It‟s vague. “I just want to let you know.” Let you know what? Let you know how? “Let you know when? I just want to let you know.” I skipped to a new one. Let me go back to the second one. “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries that radically transform lives for the better.” Whose lives? How? In what way? By the way, that word “transform,” that‟s an ambiguity. Does that mean “trance form”? Did you get the phonetic ambiguity there? Am I saying “trance form” or “transform”? “Transform,” is that a word with good positive connotations? Participants:

Yes.

Ross:

Unless, of course, you‟re Cher and your daughter just said she‟s transforming into a guy. That‟s a different thing. “Radically transform lives for the better.” In what way will the lives be better? Did I say?

Participants:

No.

Ross:

“So I thank you.” I thank you. I‟m showing gratitude toward you. Are you going to resist that? 34

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participants:

No.

Ross:

Please give me the verbal feedback. Really, it helps me. It really feeds me. So if I thank you, wow, you must be doing something great for me! Right? That then gives you an image to live up to. I‟m thanking you. That means you‟re a great person who does great things for me. Does a great person who does great things for me turn me down or resist me? Yes or no?

Participants:

No.

Ross:

As soon as you buy into that, now I‟ve really got you. This is all in the space of a few words. “I thank for allowing me.” Allowing me. What does that mean when you allow something?

Participants:

Permission.

Ross:

If I say, “I want you to listen to what I say and believe me,” as opposed to, “I just invite you to allow yourself to find your own reasons to discover how good it is to appreciate the value of this information.”

Participant:

It gives the illusion of the other person feeling like they‟re in charge.

Ross:

That‟s right.

Participant:

You‟re negating your own authority.

Ross:

I‟m not negating my authority. I‟m negating any resistance to that authority. 35

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“For allowing me.” Once you buy into the fact that you‟ve allowed me, that means you no longer resist me. Correct? Participants:

Yes.

Ross:

It‟s dissipating any resistance, and it‟s giving the illusion that you‟re the one in power, not me, so you relax and don‟t resist. Don‟t you?

Participants:

Yes.

Ross:

“To uncover this for you.” I‟m not trying to convince you of anything. I am uncovering something of no value?

Participant:

You‟re discovering something you might not see before.

Ross:

When I uncover something, is it something that you already knew, of no value? Yes or no.

Participants:

No.

Ross:

What does “uncover” imply?

Participant:

Discovery.

Ross:

“Uncover,” first of all, implies that you didn‟t know it. Now I‟m informing you, which is a valuable activity. Generally speaking, “uncover” means you‟re uncovering something of value, unless you‟re Bernie Madoff. Can you see the power of this?

Participants:

Yes.

Diana:

It sounds funny to me that you say thank you as an opening, assuming this is an opening paragraph. 36

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Sounds funny to you in what way? It‟s just being polite.

Diana:

“Thank you” usually comes as a closing if it‟s in a sales letter.

Ross:

If it was the only thing I said and it wasn‟t part of a chain of suggestions, you would be correct. It‟s already part of an ongoing chain of suggestions, and the fact that I‟m sharing something and you‟re allowing me to do it means that you‟re doing me a favor. So I thank you for it. You could also say this at the close of the presentation. “In conclusion, I want to thank you for allowing me to uncover this opportunity that I know you‟ll feel good about acting on right now.” Do you get it? You can also use it in the close.

Participant:

It also makes sense to thank you in that another implication, “It really excites me to be sharing discoveries.” On a certain level, you‟re telling them to be sharing, and then later on in the sense you‟re thanking them that they‟re going to share.

Ross:

I don‟t get that interpretation at all. I am sharing the discovery with them.

Participant:

I get that, and yet on an embedded command level, “be sharing discoveries,” some part of them is going to be sharing with you.

Ross:

Not in this context. I‟m not around for them to share. They‟re reading a sales letter. That‟s not an embedded command, but good catch.

37 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Let‟s look at the third example. “Before we begin this journey into the world of persuasion mastery.” “Begin,” and we‟ll get into this a little later, is what we call a presupposition of time, and so is “before.” “Before we begin this journey” implies that the journey is going to take place. “You have your own reasons to believe everything I‟m saying is true. Maybe even if at first you had thought that you might have resisted, I just want you to know that after you‟ve discovered that that‟s already happening, it‟s not necessary to do that any faster than you recognize that that‟s the process of suddenly realizing, yes, you do want to obey.” “Before we begin this journey.” What is a journey? Participants:

Implied value.

Ross:

It‟s an implied value now. “Before we begin this journey into the world of persuasion mastery, I just want to let you know that it‟s important to ask questions that naturally arise when you embark on something new and exciting.” What‟s the presupposition there? That it‟s going to be new and exciting. Right?

Participant:

I don‟t know what you‟re saying, but I know that you‟re saying something important, learning in ways that we haven‟t yet discovered.

Ross:

Right. I am saying something important. His comment is I don‟t even know what you‟re talking about, but I know it‟s going to be something that‟s important, that you want to discover. That‟s absolutely correct.

38 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“I just want to let you know that it‟s important to ask the questions that naturally arise when you embark on something new and exciting.” Get it? Participants:

Yes.

Ross:

Let‟s go to the next page. We‟re talking about being vague, using vague language. I draw your attention to the fact that in those last examples, I didn‟t say one specific thing. I seldom give hard-and-fast rules, but I‟m going to give you a rule here.

Generally

speaking,

whenever

possible,

begin

your

presentation, sales piece, whatever it is, with nonspecific, vague language. That starts the process of opening the imagination and the more suggestible aspects of the other person‟s consciousness. Sir, again, I‟m not picking on you. My intention is to help you. A huge problem with your sales presentation is that it„s too specific about details that don‟t address the emotions of the other person. The idea is that you want to use language that captures and leads the imagination and the emotions of people. The general rule is that when you use any specific information that you can put on a chart, graph, prospectus, syllabus or curriculum vitae, it will go into the left brain. Here‟s the thing about the left brain. I‟m speaking very nonrigorously, without any kind of scientific rigor. Generally speaking, the left brain is going to process things critically. If you use specific language, which the left brain also processes, you‟re going to activate the same part of the brain that processes critically. 39 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Whenever possible, avoid specific language. You can‟t do it all the time. For example, if you‟re writing a sales letter and describing the benefits of it, you have to get specific. When you describe the offer, exactly what they‟re going to get, how they‟re going to get it, and how they‟re going to pay for it, you have to be specific. The problem with your presentations is that they‟re loaded with all sorts of specific information that don‟t address any emotional needs. It doesn‟t activate the imagination of the other party. “It comes from the Dead Sea. The Dead Sea minerals are 50% more…,” is completely getting in the way of the presentation. If we went through it and I crossed out all the stuff you could eliminate, your sales would double. That doesn‟t seem true to you at the moment, but I invite you to discover the ways in which you can open your mind to seeing that maybe it‟s true.

40 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 6 Stories and the Unconscious Mind Vanessa:

I was wondering if stories fall into vague things or specific things, and what part of the brain…?

Ross:

Stories are really good. Thank you. My beloved genius niece brought up a really good point. Use stories or anything that sounds like a story. When I say, “Follow along as I tell you the story of how this important discovery came to be,” or if I say, “Once upon a time,” what part of your mind activates?

Participant:

The childhood stories.

Ross:

That‟s right. It doesn‟t matter now what the content of that story is. The unconscious mind recognizes form and process, not content. As long as I present it as a story, your unconscious mind will open up, be childlike, and absorb and listen, rather than be critical.

Participant:

So which ear do you speak into to activate it?

Ross:

I don‟t make those distinctions.

Participant:

Can you repeat that last point about the subconscious mind?

Ross:

The unconscious mind recognizes process and form, not content. As an example, if I said “Once upon a time,” or “A long time ago in a galaxy far, far away,” it doesn‟t matter what story I tell after that. If it‟s about giants, trolls or Wall Street investors who are honest, it doesn‟t matter because the mind is still going to recognize that it‟s a story. It‟s the same thing with a movie. When you step into the movie theater, they darken all the lights and stop the previews, and it‟s time for the show, it doesn‟t matter what the content of that movie 41

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

is. You‟re still going to willingly suspend your disbelief in order to watch it. Use something that sounds like a story, like “Follow along,” “Tag along as I uncover the story of how this came to be,” or “As I tell the story.” Generally speaking, “tell the story” works better than “tell you the story.” With “tell you the story,” people will say “Tell me a story? I‟ll tell you a story,” but when you say “tell the story,” they‟ll say, “Sure, tell.” It‟s a trance, so that‟s one case where that little word can make all the difference. When you say, “Follow along as I share the story,” or “as I tell the story,” works a hell of a lot better than saying, “Follow along as I share with you,” or “as I tell you the story.” “Follow along as I share the story.” When you say “share the story,” it‟s being vague. Share the story with whom? By leaving out who you‟re sharing it with, their unconscious says, “He‟s sharing it with me. It‟s a story. Listen.” Is that fair? Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

It‟s fair because people need to buy the products. This is one of the by-products of learning this information. This is called phonetic ambiguity. It‟s one of the things I‟ve caught a lot of flak for in the seduction world, but it does work as part of a chain of suggestions.

Participant:

The structure that you get for letters, can some of them work in a sentence?

Ross:

I didn‟t understand your question. 42

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Can I use “allow yourself” when I talk to somebody in a conversation?

Ross:

When you talk to someone, you can use some of this stuff.

Participant:

Is it more fitting to a letter?

Ross:

You could say something like this. You have a company that sells minerals, hand care, skin care and other stuff from the Dead Sea. Is that something of an accurate way, a shorthand way to describe it here? They sell it from carts. Do you ever have the girls come up to you and say, “Sir, would you like to try a fresh, free sample?” This is a suck-ass way to do it. I‟ll teach you a much better way to do it. I‟m just being blunt. Suck-ass builds a metaphor in your mind as opposed to, “It‟s not that good.” Sometimes using those metaphors punches through. I want to make you money. I will double your sales this weekend. Here‟s how you can use it. Once you get them locked in a little bit, you could say, “It‟s an interesting story where these products come from,” not “Let me tell you the story,” and then just start talking. “It‟s an interesting story how I came about these persuasion skills. You see, a long time ago…” It‟s that kind of structure. If you just add a few of these structures in, you can increase your sales by 25% to 30%. When you cut out a lot of that patter, you‟ll double your sales. Your salespeople will work less and sell more. You won‟t have the morale problem that you have with people quitting a lot. It‟s going to solve everything in one fell swoop.

43 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

I‟m going back to what you were saying about fractionation. In terms of the minds of women or even business prospects, you were saying how sometimes people will go back out and say, “I don‟t know if I‟m supposed to be experiencing this.” Are you saying that in a way that is working to your advantage? That could also be a meta-state.

Ross:

He said, “Can that fractionation process work in your favor because what if they fractionate in a way that causes them to be even more strongly involved when they go back to it?” Generally speaking, when it comes to money, it doesn‟t work that way. When it comes to romance and women, it does work that way. When it comes to spending money beyond a certain price point, people will fractionate in a way that will talk them out of doing the sale unless you structure them away from that. It‟s a brilliant distinction.

Participant:

It could also be a meta-state for someone to step out and say, “Is this going too fast, or am I really doing this?”

Ross:

That‟s exactly correct. When it comes to money, that often will happen, so you need to control that. That‟s a brilliant question.

Participant:

If I may use your example, with all due respect, why would somebody want to know a story about how the minerals came about? Why should they listen to you?

Ross:

That‟s not a question. We‟re not putting him on a hot seat. We can get to that tomorrow. Vague language allows you to have a lot of fun with people. One thing you can fractionate is going back and forth between being 44

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

vague and being specific. When you do that, it creates a powerful trance because when you‟re being vague, people are in their imaginations. When you‟re specific in a way that reinforces the vague suggestions, they suddenly have reasons to believe what you said. When you go back to being vague and suggesting, they look at the suggestions through, “This makes sense,” rather than, “I don‟t know.” That‟s one answer to your question. This is wickedly clever. I put a lot of thought into this. Nick:

I‟m a little unclear on where the suggestive meaning for the person is when they re-enter a state.

Ross:

We haven‟t gotten there yet.

Participant:

I don‟t mean to backtrack, but you put a lot of emphasis on the willing suspension of disbelief. It seems like that‟s a “go” state, a pressed-in state to start the sales pitch. What are some calibration cues to know when the prospect is in the willingly suspended state of disbelief?

Ross:

Obviously if you‟re writing a letter, then you can‟t observe them. You don‟t know. You‟re talking about face-to-face?

Participant:

Yes, in person.

Ross:

Overall, I would say to look at the focus of their attention. Are they shifting around? Are they looking at you? Do their pupils dilate? Their lower lip gets a little bit bigger. They get what I call the “doggy dinner bowl” look.

45 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Are you familiar with the Speed Seduction® stuff? This is what I call the “doggy dinner bowl” look. One or two things may happen. The amount they fidget decreases, or the amount they fidget increases. You‟ll see a change in the baseline. You don‟t know which it will be. Some people, as they move into trance, get tardive dyskinesia. Some people will get more of what you call ideomotor movements. Other people will get cataleptic, or more rigid. The key is to look for a shift, if they‟re bouncing around and suddenly shift into being quieter and still, or if they‟re quieter and still and start shifting. Look for a shift. Participant:

We should look for physiological indications of trance, like less blinking or relaxed state of comfort?

Ross:

It could be less blinking, but less blinking could be a different emotional state. People tend to blink more when they‟re emotionally agitated, so maybe they‟re just calm or bored. You don‟t know. You have to be cautious about interpreting things. Generally speaking because I‟m a hypnotist, I assume people are in trance because of the power of how I present. I‟m presenting these somewhat disjointedly. I‟m doing it so that when we workshop stuff, I can point and say, “What am I using here?” and you guys will be able to identify the tool. I want your participation. When I‟m workshopping up here with someone and you have a suggestion, raise your hand and suggest it, “Hey, why don‟t you throw that tool in?”

46 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 7 Trance and Weasel Phrases These next ones are wicked. I call them “trance phrases.” By that I mean that the use of them tends to install, deepen or increase a trance. Let me do a brief sidetrack. Look up here. I need your attention to get this transmission. When I say “trance,” I do not mean someone who is like this. That‟s not useful. I mean an altered state of consciousness that is characterized by strong focus, heightened suggestibility and that sort of thing. People go in and out of trances all the time anyway. One of the metaphors I use is that people are hypnosis machines. Hypnosis is the way you think anyway. Your mind works faster than you think. What are you not thinking about right now? “Find yourself.” What does it mean to find yourself? Did you ever just find yourself suddenly looking in the refrigerator? Before you know it, you think, “Wait a minute. I don‟t even know what I‟m looking for. What am I doing?” Did you ever have that happen to you? Do you ever find yourself humming a tune in your head and it just won‟t go away? Do you ever find yourself suddenly experiencing a state of total suggestibility or being really attracted to someone? What does “find yourself” imply? First of all, what does find yourself imply the absence of? If you‟re finding yourself doing something, what does it imply that you did not do? You didn‟t consciously choose it. Isn‟t that basically a huge component of a compulsion or habit? 47 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

How many smokers actually think, “Now I‟m going to reach for the pack. I‟m going to unwrap it. I‟m going to take out a cigarette. I‟m going to put it in my mouth. I‟m going to open up the book of matches”? It is out-of-conscious awareness. “Find yourself” implies an other-than-conscious or outside-ofconscious operation. I‟m always sprinkling this phrase throughout my sales copy. Has anyone ever read any of my sales letters? Go back and read them. Go to www.Seduction.com and click on the product catalog. You can read them to your heart‟s content. Here‟s another one, “allow yourself.” How do you allow yourself? What does that imply about control? Let go. ”Let go and let God.” See that? Do you ever watch these preachers? You want to see good hypnotists? Watch Sunday morning TV. “The Bible says… Jesus says.” They‟re pointing to themselves. I saw one preacher, he‟s a faith healer. He had a woman come up, “Reverend so-and-so, I‟m so depressed.” He said, “God takes your depression and puts it over here. It‟s like you can‟t even see it anymore when you believe in the Holy Spirit.” He took her visual image of being depressed, grabbed it, put it over here, stomped on it and then said, “It‟s like you can‟t see it.” Pair up into groups for a second. Pick a partner. Person A, visualize something. Person B, wave your hand in the person‟s face Just do it. I knew a lawyer who used to do that. He‟d put his hand in their face and wave the image away. This is part of what I said. People‟s 48 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

imagery is projected outward subjectively. If you know this, you can grab hold of it and move it. I do this with women. I should bring some footage. I‟ll ask a woman, “When you‟re really excited and attracted by a guy, what kind of thoughts do you have?” If she goes like that, then I‟ll mirror exactly where her eyes went. I‟ll say, “When you have those thoughts,” then I‟ll just go into that state again and do that later on. She‟ll look over there and have the same thoughts. Watch where people move their eyes. You‟ll see where they‟re putting their imagery. Then you can play with it. You can make it smaller or bigger or shove it in their face. You can take that image, grab it, and put it around yourself so they‟re looking at you through it. Those of you doing personal presentations, person-to-person, need to learn this stuff. Is it fair? Damn right it‟s fair. I like this one. If you were to invite yourself to really tune in right now to what it is I‟m saying in a way where you find yourself being completely convinced for your own reasons that this is really important, would that lead you to take action right now? Or would you feel yourself getting a little bit more excited before you found yourself taking action? Now I‟m warming up! Johav:

Could you be more specific about the way you take the image physically?

Ross:

When we workshop with you, I will. You have to teach your people to do some of this. They‟ll never get caught, ever. I‟ve done this 49

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

kind of stuff to certified master practitioners of NLP. They never catch me. I had a student who seduced a college psychology professor. She said, “Hypnosis is a crock.” He was giggling in the back of the room. Weasel Phrases I‟m going to teach you something called “weasel phrases.” Weasel phrases allow you to put in any kind of command. A weasel phrase takes the form of, “If you were to ____,” or “If I were to ____.” Who are the Speed Seduction® students? Raise your hands. You know about weasel phrases, right? “If you were to discover yourself getting really excited about what I‟m presenting, how quickly might you convince yourself that this opportunity is something you have to act on right now?” If I were to say to you, “Open your wallet and give me your money,” I wouldn‟t use that. Discover yourself. Convince yourself. This is wicked. I‟m not sure exactly how quickly you could find yourself giving yourself permission to convince yourself that this is worthwhile, but as that‟s happening, you see? What does it mean to convince yourself? Let‟s parse this out. If I say, “Convince yourself,” what does that mean? Do you ever convince yourself something is true? Participant:

All the time. Isn‟t that a form of self-fractionation? 50

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Hold on, you‟re really close. Think about what has to be going on in your head. In order for you to convince yourself of something, you have to create something of a dissociation inside of you. You have to have a little bit of doubt that you overcome. It‟s like splitting your mind between how much you believe it and how much you don‟t believe it. Therefore, it‟s creating a hypnotic dissociation. To the hypnotist in the back of the room, is hypnotic dissociation a useful phenomenon?

Participant:

In a word, yes.

Ross:

These are called trance phrases because when you use them, people begin to develop a trance. Here‟s an example. Guys, this is really good. You must use this. I command you, Ken, to use this. “As you discover yourself getting more excited about what I have to say, it‟s not necessary to find yourself growing truly eager to learn more.” Applause, please! That‟s really good. I give you permission and encourage you to steal that word for word. I invite you to discover yourself stealing it word for word. I don‟t care. You may steal that. I have an assignment for you because I want to save my voice. We‟re going to take 10 minutes, and I want each one of you to take this sentence and parse it out. That means for each little bit of language, I want you to identify what tool it is and what it does.

51 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

For example in this one, you would say, “Discover yourself.” You would underline it and note “trance phrase.” Next you would put what effect it has. That‟s the first assignment. The second assignment is to go through this sentence and identify all the places where it‟s being vague. I‟ll help you. For example, “As you discover,” you would say, “Discover what? Discover in what way? How will I discover myself? In what way? To what effect?” What I‟d like you to do is pick a partner. The two of you are going to work together on this, and then we‟re going to go through it. The two people who do the best, I‟m going to take to lunch with me either tomorrow or Sunday.

52 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 8 Parsing More Vague Language Ross:

That‟s the most important thing I can teach you about persuasion and the International Persuaders Guild forbids me repeating it. For those of you at home, I had given the assignment to parse through these phrases, identify the tools being used, and then point out where the vague language is. Let‟s start with Paul. From Page 7, tell me what you saw.

Paul:

As you discover yourself, “As you” I figure is a process in itself. It‟s a pacing thing. Whatever you‟re already doing, you‟re going along with it. “Discover yourself” is a trance phrase. You can discover some things about yourself that you may not consciously decide. Something that may come up to help you make the decision that you might not even know about. “Getting more excited.” Who is getting more excited? It‟s an ambiguity. Is it you getting more excited? Is it the client? You might find yourself asking yourself, “About what?” at the same time. As you read it in your head, you‟re asking, “Getting excited about what?” What you read is facing your own thoughts. “I have to say” could be “Who has to say?” Would it be the reader?

Ross:

No, that‟s not true. I‟m saying it‟s what I have to say.

Paul:

“I have to say” could also be an act of God. I feel compelled to say it. I have to say it.

Ross:

No. 53

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Paul:

“It‟s not necessary.” The subconscious mind does not get negation.

Ross:

It doesn‟t? You just said it does not get negation.

Paul:

No. “It‟s not necessary” is also an embedded command saying it is necessary.

Ross:

No, it‟s not a command.

Paul:

Subconsciously, it takes off the pressure from the reader.

Ross:

That‟s true. It does remove the pressure.

Paul:

“To find yourself” is doing something unconsciously, which is a trance phrase. “Growing truly eager” is an embedded command.

Ross:

There‟s more in there that he hasn‟t discovered, so there is room for you guys.

Paul:

It‟s also finding yourself growing. It‟s an unconscious act. “To learn more” where learn is a valuable activity. Learn more of what? It also opens you to possibility.

Ross:

Out of 100, I‟ll give you a 70 on that. Who else wants to give it a swing?

Johav:

“Find yourself growing” is also accelerating. “Find yourself growing truly eager” is giving you more acceleration to do it.

Ross:

“Find yourself” is not the acceleration, though.

Johav:

“Make yourself eager.” You are eager to find what? It‟s accelerating. 54

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

You could say, “Eager about what?” but I wouldn‟t say that‟s accelerating. You guys are still at 70. Not bad though, good effort. Give him a hand. Let‟s go over here and we‟ll fractionate back and forth.

Elmar:

“As you” is a weasel phrase. “Discover yourself,” they already said is an embedded command. Also, “discover” like you mentioned “uncover,” implies value. “Getting more excited” implies that you are already excited about what I have to say.

Ross:

Excellent.

Elmar:

“What I have to say” is incredibly vague. They‟re already filling in the blank with their own meaning. “It‟s not necessary,” they already mentioned this is negation. “To find yourself” is a trance phrase. “Growing truly eager” is an embedded command. Also, “truly” is a superlative to what kind of eager I‟m already feeling. That means you have to go back in your own experience and compare what eager means for you.

Ross:

Brilliant. Let me stop and parse out what he said. This word “truly” is a fantastic thing to throw in front of anything else you do. One of the things I first learned about this was doing Speed Seduction®. A girl would occasionally say, “I have a boyfriend.” I would say, “Is he filling a role, or is he filling needs that you truly desire inside?” 55

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

First of all, what does it mean to truly desire, and what do you have to do to find out what you truly desire? What depth of your mind do you need to go into to find what you like, what your desire and what you truly desire? Alex:

“Truly” taps into something you‟re hiding from other people.

Ross:

“Truly” taps into something very deep, whether you‟re hiding it from yourself or another person or just haven‟t yet discovered that you truly desire to listen.

Alex:

It‟s something in the core of your being.

Ross:

It‟s something in the core of who you are. “Truly,” when you put it in front of something, creates almost a trans-derivational search, where you‟re going to go deep inside to find that meaning. This is great. When someone uses the objection, “I already have that,” or “Someone is already taking care of that in my company,” just say, “I‟m sure there‟s someone there filling that role. You‟re the only person who can now decide for yourself as you ponder, are they truly fulfilling the needs of what your company really wants?” We‟ll parse that out later. “Truly” means really, specially deep in that private place where you snuggle under the covers and touch yourself in the way mom said not to. Is there anything else?

Elmar:

To finish, “to learn more” implies you are already taking part in a shared, valued activity.

56 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s correct. Did you get what he‟s saying there? If I‟m saying, “You‟re going to grow truly eager to learn more,” it presupposes that you already are learning. It presupposes also that you‟re engaged in a valuable activity since you‟re learning.

Elmar:

I do have one final thing to add, Ross. The way you phrased the last part, “It‟s not necessary to find yourself growing truly eager,” is a process, which you could later use as a filter to come back to and institute what you call the periodic recursive.

Ross:

You‟re really close. I‟m going to give you half credit on that. Let me explain what I mean. Listen to the distinction. Let‟s see if we can parse it out. If I say, “Find yourself truly eager,” or “Find yourself feeling truly eager,” versus “Find yourself growing truly eager,” what‟s the difference in the emotional and imaginative effect? You‟re saying, “Find yourself truly eager,” “Find that you are truly eager,” and “Find yourself growing truly eager.”

Participant:

It builds the feeling.

Ross:

It builds it. That‟s right. It‟s growing. I didn‟t say to stop, did I?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

The implication could very well be, “And it‟s going to keep on going and going.” Do you see the subtlety in this? My meditation teacher, in a completely different context, had something to say about this. By the way, this guy is to meditation what Milton Erickson was to hypnosis. I kid you not. 57

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Who is he?

Ross:

Shinzen Young. He‟s teaching next week in L.A. Think about this. “Growing” implies that it‟s a process that‟s gathering momentum, doesn‟t it? Think about that. When you fall in love with someone, don‟t you find a growing fascination with this person? The process of falling out of love is when that growth stops and then diminishes.

Participant:

It also could be a pacing word, because you might be pacing something that‟s already going on. As you‟re going along, they could be getting more interested, so you‟re pacing something that‟s going on.

Ross:

That‟s true.

Participant:

The whole statement itself created filters of anticipation, if you read the whole thing, and then you see whatever comes after it.

Ross:

That‟s right. Explain how. What parts of statement did that? In what way does it do that? You‟re absolutely correct.

Participant:

I read it, and after, I wondered, “What‟s coming next? What is it that he has to tell me? I have no idea what he‟s talking about, yet I have this feeling that I‟m waiting for something to come that I‟m really interested in already.”

Ross:

If I put this really early on, you‟re then going to look at rest of my message through excitement, “Wow! I can‟t wait for the next thing.” Isn‟t that a hell of a lot better than having you be skeptical, mistrusting or uncertain?

Participant:

Yes. 58

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Isn‟t that then going to modify anything else I do because you‟re going to be looking at it through this filter? The minute people buy into this, it empowers them to become more gullible and more suggestible to what it is you have to trick them into doing. I‟m just teasing on that last part. You get it?

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

Very good.

Participant:

You‟re suggesting the state of excited eagerness in there as well, which is that anticipation effectively.

Ross:

How did I do that? I‟m using the term “more excited.”

Participant:

Amplification.

Ross:

I‟m using the term “more.” “More” is an adverb presupposition. An adverb modifies a verb, so “more excited” implies that you‟re excited in the first place. It presupposes that you‟re excited. You may not be, but it presupposes it.

Greg:

I just wanted to add a couple of things that we talked about, as opposed to doing the whole thing. The “not necessary” word, I don‟t know the best way to describe it, seems to give the person the illusion of power in that they can say no, even though they really can‟t say no, based upon the totality of the sentence.

Ross:

I‟m going to tell you something. “It‟s not necessary” and “It‟s not important” are two of the most powerful hypnotic phrases you can throw into anything. I use “It‟s not important” or “It‟s not necessary” 59

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

a lot, because it‟s vague on so many levels. Thank you for pointing it out. Milton Erickson, the famous hypnotist from whom NLP and everything else grew, used to do this a lot. He‟d say, “Now, it‟s not necessary to go into trance.” First of all, it‟s not necessary according to whom? It‟s not necessary for whom? Because it‟s not necessary, therefore you‟re allowed to do it. “Bobby, it‟s not necessary for you to clean up your room.” A kid is going to say, “Okay, then I‟m not.” You understand? Saying it‟s not necessary gives permission to have the experience. It‟s like saying to allow yourself. Very good. Participant:

The other thing was that the entire phrase implies that the relationship between the reader and you is that of teacher and learner.

Ross:

Brilliantly so. How does it do that?

Participant:

In the context of them wanting to learn, it implies that you‟re going to be the teacher and that you‟re going to be doing it together in some way.

Ross:

That‟s right. It also implies something else. There‟s a reverse causation here. It implies that their realization of their excitement is a valuable thing. There‟s a meta-stating tool here, too. This is really clever. This is sickly genius-clever. You can consider me Dr. Evil. If you have a hairless cat, I would be petting it. You‟re

60 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

getting this, really big-time. The lights are going on. You‟ve been born again. Hallelujah! As you discover yourself getting more excited, think about this. You‟re discovering that something positive is happening and growing inside you about what I have to say. It implies that what I have to say is the catalyst for that discovery, and it also implies that the more you discover that happening, the more excited you can get. What it says is that as you discover yourself getting excited, you should feel good about it because you‟re about to get even more excited. Notice the distinction. I didn‟t say, “As you discover yourself getting excited about what I have to say.” I said, “As you discover yourself getting more excited.” What does that imply? It implies that the excitement is going to grow and that they will continue to return to that discovery. “My excitement is growing.” Thirty seconds in, they find themselves feeling excited. A minute later, they say, “I‟m getting more excited,” and then two minutes later, they say, “Wow! I just discovered I‟m more excited. Wow! Now I‟m even more excited here than I was over there. Therefore, the process of excitement must be good. Whenever I find myself getting excited about what he says, I should say, „Hallelujah! That‟s a good sign.‟” This is one of the examples of managing people‟s responses to their primary state by conditioning them into what state to go into as they reflect upon it.

61 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Essentially, I‟m saying that the discovery is not just about what I‟m saying. The discovery is also about the person‟s own process of excitement. In this sentence, “discover” has not only to do with what I‟m telling them. The discovery is about his or her own process of getting excited and feeling good about it. By using the word “discover” and the word “more,” we set up a loop where they feel excited and then they say, “I‟m feeling excited. He said I would. He‟s right, and I feel good about it. Look, I just had another discovery. I‟m feeling excited. That‟s what he said would happen. I must be getting it.” You see what I‟m doing? I‟m training them not just to feel excited but to have moments of discovery of their excitement. “I just discovered I‟m excited.” In order to discover you‟re excited, you can‟t be in the excitement, can you? You have to pop out of it to look at it. I‟m going really fast, but I‟m going to say it again. For you to realize that you‟re excited, for you to realize that you‟re curious, you can‟t be in the curiosity. In the moment of realization, you have to split your consciousness and look at the curiosity and say, “I‟m feeling curious.” This is setting up that loop. Here‟s what it‟s saying. The more you discover the value of what I say and the more you discover how excited you are, the more excited and happy you can get about that excitement in such a way as it continues to build as you continue to read, listen or watch. That‟s what you‟re doing. This is an example of what I said. Again, here‟s what I want you to do, guys, just for a second. I want you to cross out the word “more” 62 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

in that sentence. I want you to cross out the word “truly” and the word “growing.” Now let‟s read it that way. “As you discover yourself getting excited about what I have to say, it‟s not necessary to find yourself eager to learn more.” Does it have the same kind of punch? Does it set up to same kind of loop? Is it good? Is it powerful? Sure. What I want to do periodically throughout the persuasion is return to this kind of thing. It sets up a really powerful reinforcing loop. Are you enjoying this? Participants:

Yes.

Ross:

Are you discovering that the more you enjoy, the more eagerly you look forward to enjoying even more? I also call this “Thought Binding.” There‟s a pattern that says “the more, the more.” This is an implied “the more, the more,” so I‟m going even further into it. “The more you listen to what I say, the more you can discover your excitement at discovering your excitement at what it is I have to say.” Say what?

Participant:

When you said that “learn” is that one powerful word where people wouldn‟t want to deny learning something, they‟re going to automatically say yes to it, because saying no to it would be going against what‟s acceptable.

Ross:

Yes. Check this out. This is really sick, in a good way. It‟s also giving them a self-image to live up to. It‟s presupposing that it‟s not 63

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

a sale. It‟s learning. It‟s presupposing that the more they believe what I say, the better they are as a learner. The more that they resist what I say, the worse they are as a learner. Therefore, to believe what I say and get excited about it is proof of just how smart they are. It implies it without saying it. If I said to you, “I just want to let you know that the more you agree with what I say, the smarter it proves that you are and the better learner you are…” Participant:

I‟d say yes.

Ross:

No, you wouldn‟t. You‟d flip me the bird if I said that directly. You understand what I mean, assuming that you did not know me and powerfully recognize my genius.

Participant:

Right.

Ross:

I‟m really astonished at how good you guys are. This either means I‟m a fantastic teacher, or it means that I‟m an amazing teacher. Grandma would be proud, wouldn‟t she? Yes, she would.

Participant:

“Find yourself growing” just by itself without the “truly eager” is a positive thing that gets in there. The whole sentence implies authority because you‟re basically telling them what‟s going to happen and what‟s going on.

Ross:

That‟s true. It‟s implied authority rather than assumed authority. Look at the difference. Assumed authority is me saying, “Let me tell you the way it is.”

Participant:

At the very end when you say “learn more,” it revalidates the “getting more excited.” 64

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s correct.

Participant:

It goes back to that. When you say “getting more excited about,” that takes it from getting excited and then it fractionates into “about.” It takes them out of it and puts the thing in there.

Ross:

Very good. Did you hear what he said? How can you get excited about something if you‟re in it? You have to step out of it to get excited about it. Very good.

Participant:

There is a lot of vagueness, but we‟re not going through those right now, I guess.

Ross:

Point out the vague language.

Participant:

“Discover.” How so? “Getting more excited.” How so? “What he has to say.” About what? “It‟s not necessary.” Says who? “Find yourself growing.” How so? “Learn more about.” What? In what way? “Excited.” In what way? “What I have to say.” About what? “Growing.” In what way?

Ross:

Fantastic! That was awesome. I love to teach. It‟s the most fun I can have with my clothes on. You know what I really love about it? I‟m sitting here tinkering around in my laboratory of language, saying, “Oh my god, this is great!” I‟m thinking, “Hello? Does anyone want to see this?” I get to share my toys with you guys. Once you get this stuff, you can never go back to not knowing it. Once you see the Matrix, you can never go back. I‟m completely serious. I‟m having a profound effect on your consciousness. I get

65 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

to go in and tinker with your minds in such a way that you‟ll never see the world the same way every again. That‟s pretty cool. That‟s part of the fun of being an uncle, too, by the way. It‟s what I do as an uncle. Participant:

We divided this into two parts, analysis and synthesis.

Ross:

I like it. It‟s dialectic. We have thesis, antithesis and synthesis.

Participant:

The analysis is just analyzing the basic roles each word plays. We have weasel phrases like “as you” and “it‟s not necessary.”

Ross:

Correct.

Participant:

In the synthesis phase, we‟ll come back to what they do. We have trance phrases, such as “discover yourself” and “find yourself.”

Ross:

Fantastic.

Participant:

We also have a state process distinction.

Ross:

Where is that?

Participant:

The states are excitement and eagerness. From getting more excited and growing truly eager, we have excitedness and eagerness as states. As came out in the earlier discussion, the “getting more” and “growing truly” bring process into it. We have a state/process distinction.

Ross:

Let me make sure you all understand what he just said. That‟s brilliant! I want to explode with joy as I share this, it‟s so exciting to me. 66

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Here‟s what he‟s saying. Excited is a state. You‟re feeling excited. What else would be an example of a state? Participant:

Joy.

Participant:

Fear.

Participant:

Happiness.

Ross:

Getting excited is a process. True? Going to the store is different than the store. Eager is a state. Growing eager is a process. You‟re using both, and each reinforces the other. You‟re a smart man, but I knew that.

Participant:

Now we have embedded commands.

Ross:

Where are the embedded commands?

Participant:

The most explicit one is “learn more”.

Ross:

That‟s basic. “Learn more” is a command. “Growing truly eager to learn more,” “Growing truly eager to listen to me closely.” Every word is packed with power. There is no fat in this. This is all muscle.

Participant:

A little more subtle is “learn more.” It‟s obvious. “Getting more excited” and “growing,” if you lean on the “get” and the “grow,” you also get an embedded command, although it‟s not as strong as the “learn more.”

Ross:

I‟m going to disagree there. It‟s splitting hairs and has almost no effect. That‟s a shadow that reflects no substance, but it‟s smart thinking nonetheless.

67 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

By the way, it doesn‟t even say when I‟m going to say it, either. Listen to this. It says, “Getting more excited about what I have to say.” It doesn‟t tell you when I‟m going to say it, which means you have to pay attention constantly to make sure you don‟t miss anything. Notice the difference in the meaning and the sentence. One way to learn this is to either subtract elements or add elements, and see the difference. Compare it against the example. “As you discover yourself getting more excited about what I have to say a minute from now, it‟s not necessary to find yourself growing truly eager to learn more.” That sets the time at one minute and then you‟re done with it. By not saying when, it makes it an ongoing process that never stops.

68 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 9 Non-Specific Time and Thought Binding Being non-specific as to time is extraordinarily powerful. Hold on a minute. It‟s also how people bind problems to themselves. Who thinks they‟re not good at something? What are you not good at? Participant:

I‟m not good at cooking.

Ross:

That statement is non-specific as to time. It doesn‟t just say that every experience he‟s had until now, he‟s not been good at cooking. It also, because it‟s non-specified to time, implies, “I‟m not good at cooking in this moment, and will continue to not be good at cooking all through the future.” It‟s not merely a description of his past. It‟s an affirmation about the present and a prediction of the future because it‟s non-specified through time. You can bind people‟s minds by being non-specified through time. You can also point out to people how they‟re binding their minds by getting specific about time. When people are deeply trapped in something, it‟s because they‟re gluing something back to themselves by being nonspecific in time. For example, if someone comes to me and says, “I‟m not good at meeting women,” I like to point out to them that the truth is, “Up until this moment, you have not been good meeting women.” That way, it paces their reality. It opens the possibility of unbinding that from the present and the future.

69 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I‟ve bound people through time here by not saying when I‟m going to say it. This is useful. Be aware of how, up until this moment, you had bound yourself through time in ways that were not useful. Unbind yourself by getting specific. Getting specific here would take a lot of the power out of the train of suggestion. Getting specific with yourself sets you free from your own chains of suggestion that bind you through time. If you said, “From February 20, 1969 to June 23, 2009, I was not good at math,” that doesn‟t necessarily say anything about now or the future. It just states a specific time period. Participant:

Vagueness includes, “What I have to say,” that you just discussed. It also includes “eager to learn more” because the object of “to learn” is not explicit.

Ross:

Right. I‟m not saying “learning what.” It‟s another way of not specifying what you‟re going to learn. I‟m not specifying when I‟m going to say it. I‟m also not specifying when they‟re going to learn it, which means they have to be constantly alert and open to it or they‟ll miss. The sentence doesn‟t read, “As you discover yourself getting more excited about what I have to say, it‟s not necessary to find yourself growing truly eager to learn more on paragraph three, line eight, word five.” It ruins it, doesn‟t it? I‟m nonspecific as to time in the following places. I don‟t tell them when they‟re going to discover. It‟s nonspecific to time so they apply it throughout. I‟m not telling them when they‟re going to get 70

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

more excited or when I‟m going to say things. By being nonspecific as to time throughout, they have to apply it all the way through. Do you see the power of this? Participant:

Valuable activity verbs include discover, learn, grow, and find.

Ross:

I‟m going to dock you on “grow.” Grow may not be something that I‟m doing with them. They could be growing while I‟m not growing.

Participant:

I‟ll add one more thing to the analysis, which is that “what I have to say” provides the real axis to the entire sentence. This is where the value lies. It also provides a bit of mystery, which then provides an anchor for curiosity.

Ross:

Essentially what you‟re saying is the thing that‟s going to create all of this is my speaking and their listening.

Participant:

“What I have to say” is a noun phrase that provides the axis of value.

Ross:

I don‟t know if it‟s a noun phrase, but it‟s where all the value of this is centered. I‟ll give you that.

Mike:

Speaking of all the value in that phrase, “what I have to say” implies that it‟s important and necessary.

Ross:

I didn‟t mean it that way. “What I have to say” is “I have something to give you,” but it‟s a good ambiguity. I‟m going to give you a point on that. He‟s saying, “I have to say it.” That‟s not what I meant. It means, “I possess something that I‟m going to say.” That‟s a good ambiguity that I did not spot. 71

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

I remember from one of your previous seminars. You were talking about using confusion to jar their mind so that they can then not focus on what‟s being said, but more of the embedded commands in the adjectives are being used.

Ross:

Did I say confusion or ambiguity?

Participant:

This was in Speed Seduction®. You were talking about startling their mind for a second.

Ross:

That‟s a seduction thing.

Participant:

I was wondering because “it‟s not necessary,” in the rhythm of the whole sentence, you have to really think hard about what it means.

Ross:

“It‟s not necessary” is another example of being vague. It‟s reinforcing the trance by creating vagueness. It‟s not necessarily confusion.

Participant:

We also talked about how that‟s kind of a negation. If you say, “Don‟t think of a blue car.” You automatically think of a blue car.

Ross:

In effect, when you say, “It‟s not necessary,” you‟re saying, “It is necessary.”

Participant:

That‟s what the mind automatically gravitates toward. “As you” and “discover yourself” are cool ones, because in “discover yourself” three things are going on.

Ross:

Everyone, cover up the word “yourself” and read everything else in the sentence out loud, except for that word. What if I said, “As you get more excited about what I have to say, it‟s not necessary to grow truly eager to learn more”? It‟s not as 72

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

powerful, is it? What does it mean to find yourself? Look at the ambiguity. The ambiguity is yourself or your self. Participant:

“Discover yourself” presupposes that the person, prospect or client is in a state of confusion, of not knowing themselves.

Ross:

No, I wouldn‟t say that. It‟s not implying that they‟re in a state of confusion. Again, to say, “find yourself” or “discover yourself” creates a hypnotic dissociation. A part of you has to know something that a part of you doesn‟t know until the other part shares it. Now both parts know. If I say, “Find yourself,” the process of finding yourself, discovering something means that a part of you doesn‟t know something. Then suddenly part of you knows it, and the other part of you recognizes that part knows it. You‟re creating a hypnotic dissociation. Every time you create a hypnotic dissociation, the person goes into trance a little bit deeper. I want you to stop. That‟s another great hypnotic word, “stop.” Everything stops for a moment. Look at what we‟re packing into 25 words. We‟re stacking all of these tools together. When you stack this many tools together, people can‟t resist it. Furthermore, they don‟t want to resist it because the mind likes this stuff. The really beautiful thing is, if you say this verbally instead of writing it, they‟ll never remember exactly what you said. This is what I call process language.

73 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

The conscious mind cannot remember process language. I can remember it because I have trained my ear, but 99.9% of the people in the world cannot remember process language. They‟ll respond to it, but they can‟t remember what you‟ve said. Participant:

When you have a sentence or two like this, packed with process language, would it be important to, before this chunk of words and afterward, have something that‟s a little more content-filled and factual?

Ross:

Afterward. This sets them up to be totally, “Okay, whatever you say.”

Participant:

There is a certain point where you don‟t want to continue with process language.

Ross:

Absolutely. You have to be specific at some point to tell them what the price is, what the offer is, what they‟re going to pay, how they‟re going to pay, and to pick up the phone now.

Participant:

Would you say that after this is when you would start?

Ross:

Not necessarily. Yes, at some point after this, but immediately after this? I don‟t know. It depends on the context. It‟s a good question.

Participant:

Is a sentence like this as effective in written format?

Ross:

Absolutely. It‟s just as powerful in written form as it is verbally. It‟s beautiful. It really is. Who did I say got 98? You three are coming to lunch. I find myself excited about the growing discovery of how many people I reward as proof that I am a great teacher. I just discovered 74

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

how excited I am at being more excited about discovering it. You guys should be trembling at some point at how powerful this is. Page 8. Trance words are words which tend to cause the person to have an inward focus of attention and to access the imagination and the more suggestible parts of the mind. I said “tend to.” It doesn‟t guarantee that they will, but they tend to. For example, “wonder.” In order to wonder, what faculty are you using,

your

critical

reasoning?

Generally

speaking,

you‟re

visualizing too, right? “Imagine,” clearly. “Ponder,” what does it mean to ponder? Let me think about that. Come on, that deserved more of a laugh! Did you get it at home? Ponder. Contemplate. If you‟re contemplating, you‟re inwardly focused. Picture. These are simple. Guys, the eighth one is “wicked.” Please circle it. What are you going to tell Professor Burns? Am I doing a great job here? Is he in Brazil yet? No. I love that guy. False profession of ignorance, “I don‟t know,” “I‟m not sure,” or “I can‟t tell.” “I don‟t know, as you continue to listen carefully, just how excited you‟ll grow at your discovery of how amazing learning this stuff is as that‟s happening.“ “I don‟t know,” “I‟m not sure,” “I can‟t tell,” sets up a chain of suggestion and dissipates resistance. The opposite would be, “I know what‟s good for you. I‟m going to tell you what‟s going to happen.”

75 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I like to leave this message. I‟d use it if I were dating. I‟ll use it with anyone. “Hey ____, it‟s Ross. I don‟t know where you‟ll be when you get this message or what you‟ll be doing when you get this message. I do know you can remember the fun we had talking and look forward to talking again. Here‟s my number. Why don‟t you see if you can catch me?” “I don‟t know what you‟ll be doing as you get this message.” What do they have to do? They have to imagine in their mind what they‟re doing, which creates a hypnotic dissociation. It‟s also a truism. “When you‟ll get this message.” they have to think, “It‟s 10:30.” “What you‟ll be doing as you get this message.” What are they doing as they get this message? They‟re getting the message. It‟s another dissociation. It‟s pacing the reality. It‟s showing that, “I‟m a totally humble guy. I don‟t know, but I do know that you can remember how much fun we had talking and look forward to talking again.” Now I drop in the command, “Remember how much fun we had talking and look forward to talking again. My number is ____. Why don‟t you see if you can catch me?” What does that mean? Does that mean catch up to me or catch me, as in a person you want to be with in some way? “I‟m not sure,” that‟s a humble guy, right? Can you argue with me when I say, “I‟m not sure, I don‟t know”? No. Participant:

Is it a word that if you say it before you start a sentence, it will build more credibility? 76

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

It will build rapport. People won‟t resist you if you say, “I don‟t know.” In a sense, you are saying you know. When I say, “I don‟t know when you‟ll get this message, or what you‟ll be doing when you get this message, or where you‟ll be when you get this message,” it‟s saying “I don‟t know.” At the same time, it‟s saying, “I do know that you‟ll be somewhere, you‟ll be doing something, and you‟ll get it at a certain time.”

Participant:

You interject yourself into their life.

Ross:

Exactly. They think, “It feels like he‟s here with me,” which could be kind of creepy. Yes, genius, gorgeous, Scott, who is skyrocketing my Twitter following?

Scott:

Don‟t you have to be a little bit careful with that, though? You don‟t want to say, “I don‟t know if this is going to work for you.”

Ross:

Of course you have to be careful.

Scott:

You use this when you‟re still in the vague stage more than when you‟re in the specific stage?

Ross:

Absolutely. “As you follow along in this exploration today.” Look at what I‟m stacking right here, “I‟m not sure just which of these breakthroughs you‟ll find yourself really enjoying and embracing, but I think as you imagine that, you‟ll feel this is really worthwhile.” After a while, you get used to talking this way. It starts pouring out of your mouth. It‟s like talking in tongues. Pacing words are “as you” and “while you.” 77

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“As you sit there listening while you grow more and more curious about what it is, you‟re already beginning to discover with growing excitement how fun it is to learn from an expert and master teacher. I‟m not sure just what it is you can do to show your appreciation.” Participant:

Do “as you” and “while you” establish authority?

Ross:

They‟re pacing words. It doesn‟t necessarily establish authority. Presuppositions of time, now we‟re getting into classic NLP. Up until now it‟s been pretty original.

Participant:

Would you explain what NLP is?

Ross:

NLP is Neuro-Linguistic Programming. It is a system of thinking created by John Grinder, Richard Bandler, Robert Dilts, Judith DeLozier, and a couple of other people that is a model for understanding the process of human subjectivity. It‟s a way to look at the recipes by which people produce their thinking and their excellence or stuckness. From that way of thinking has evolved a trail of techniques that you can apply. Presuppositions of time are: before, after, prior, when, once, and now. Before you tune in carefully to what it is you‟re really learning from me today, I just want to say that once that‟s happening, you don‟t need to discover now when it began. Presuppositions of time are powerful. Before you find yourself using them, I just want to say that after that happens, you can look back on this moment as having been the start of it. 78

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

What did I just do with your sense of time? I flipped it all over the place. I put you here, I put you later, and then I put you back over there. This is another principle with which you can pseudo-orient your audience, listener or prospect in time. They‟re here, they‟re before, they‟re after, and then they‟re after looking back on now as having been the start of before. Participant:

As soon as you said that, I imagined looking back.

Ross:

Exactly. It‟s part of my incredible connection pattern with women. “When you fall in love with someone and you feel that incredible connection, sometimes it‟s almost as if you can stop and imagine a time in the future, say six months from now, looking back on this moment of loving as having been the start of all of that.” The girl is blushing. The girl got it. Why? Because girls do that. Girls like to think, “Mrs. Ross Jeffries, mm!” Am I lying or am I telling the truth? Guys, women not only fractionate back and forth among emotions, they fractionate back and forth through time. Presuppositions of awareness are: recognize, realize, notice, sense, conclude and become aware. “As you recognize the value of what it is you‟re continuing to grow excited about learning, you don‟t need to realize that‟s happening any faster than you can notice how much sense it makes to feel that for yourself.” Did I say anything at all specific? Let‟s combine them. What is before? “Before you notice how powerful this information is, it‟s not necessary to realize that after

79 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

that‟s happened you can become aware of how grateful you are to yourself for opening up your mind to me right now.” Adverb/adjective presuppositions are: naturally, powerfully, swiftly and clearly. “As you naturally discover your own reasons to agree with every word I say, before you rapidly discover just how much you‟re enjoying learning with me tonight, are you not? It‟s not necessary to swiftly conclude for all your own right reasons that there is something else you still want to learn. As that‟s happening, I just want to say that‟s the process of growing ever more curious about a fantastic body of information that you want for yourself.” Participant:

Does this particular style of persuasion work better in person or in print?

Ross:

Either way. I use it all the time. Haven‟t you seen some of my sales letters where I‟ll say something like, “Won‟t it be great after you‟ve picked up the phone and ordered your course today? Then you can just smile that big smile of satisfaction, sigh to yourself on the inside, and think, „This is the greatest decision I‟ve ever made.‟” You think, “No way would people buy that.” Yes, they do! I want to challenge you. This is a personal challenge. Take the one tool that you think would never work and really master that one. I want you to master all of them, but really take the one that you think couldn‟t possibly work and get excited about that. Commands and suggestions. Commands take the form of “Do X,” “Feel X,” “Decide X,” where X is whatever you want them to do. 80

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“Order now. Keep reading. Keep listening. Think X. Do that. Feel excited. Feel aroused. Feel open.” They‟re very simple. The distinction between a suggestion and a command is this. Sometimes the distinction blurs. Commands and suggestions are kissing cousins. The distinction is that suggestions, generally speaking, tell the person who has just received the command how to interpret it. If I say, “When you look at someone and you feel really fascinated as you go inside and find your own reasons to discover you really want more, just because that‟s happening now doesn‟t mean it‟s on.” All those were commands. “It‟s on” is a suggestion. The suggestion tells the person‟s mind how to interpret the fact that they‟re feeling all of these things. Remember, I said that I‟m going to train you not only to have people in the primary state, but how to interpret that state. The suggestion is a way of telling the unconscious mind that, “Yes, the fact that these commands are happening means you should either feel this way about it or take this action toward it.” You‟re a master hypnotist. What would you say is the distinction between a command and a suggestion, if you don‟t mind sharing? Participant:

Usually with the command you‟ll encounter some resistance, whereas with a suggestion there is no resistance.

Ross:

With an embedded command, you won‟t have resistance. What‟s the distinction between the function of an embedded command and a suggestion, if you draw one? I would say a suggestion tells the person how to interpret the commands or what 81

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

action to take based on the commands, but they‟re kissing cousins to each other. By the way, I really love to do that. Just because you‟re feeling excited today about this opportunity doesn‟t mean it‟s on. Just because you‟re feeling excited doesn‟t mean it‟s time to take action. “Take action” is a command, but “It‟s time to take action” is a suggestion that incorporates the command. It‟s a small difference, but I wanted to split that hair for you. That‟s basically it for this evening. Yes, genius Scott? Scott:

We spent most of the pages before that one suggesting things without using a command. That page was about actually direct commands. What‟s the right mixture or the right timing to use both?

Ross:

I can‟t give you percentages. I do far more embedded commands than suggestions. I can‟t give you a mix, though. It‟s really not that important. Don‟t worry about it. Here‟s the way it‟s going to work. Tomorrow we‟re going to start at 10:00. There are four workshop groups, so I‟m going to be able to give you a lot more time than an hour. We‟ll probably go from 10:00 to 7:00 tomorrow. We‟re not going to go late in to the evening. We‟ll still have plenty of time to more than cover you. I may take more people, but we‟ll see. Your homework assignment is to sit down and write out what your goals are for mastering this material. However, there is a distinction. You are not allowed to say, “I want,” or “I‟m going to,” or “I desire.” You‟re not allowed to use any of those things.

82 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

You can‟t say, “I want to use these tools to achieve $100,000 a year in income.” You can‟t say, “I‟m going to use these tools,” or “I desire to use these tools.” Want and desire imply lack and separation. When you say, “I want to make a lot of money,” that implies that you and money are separated. Phrase it differently. We‟ll see how you do that. I‟ll see you tomorrow at 10:00. Was it a great first evening?

83 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 10 Fundamental Building Blocks of Reality Ross:

Welcome to Day 2. This morning, I was listening to some tapes of an advanced hypnosis seminar I taught in 2005. The person who was supposed to do it was strung out on drugs, so I pinch hit for the guy. It was really quite good stuff. I never released it to the public except as a bonus for my Speed Seduction® 3.0 course. One of the things I was talking about was the fundamental building blocks of our reality, where we construct our normal sense of identity. When you get up in the morning, how long does it take for you to recognize that it‟s you who has awakened? How long does it take for your program that says, “Here I am. I‟m me,” to boot up? There is a brief moment when you‟re awake but that “I” is not booted up yet. The whole notion that there is a self in there may just be a construct we‟ve been taught that isn‟t true. First of all, the notion that you are a self is something that is not necessarily inherently there. It has to be taught to you. Part of that is the very act of naming you. You can‟t name something that‟s a process. You only name a thing. My point is that the fundamental building blocks that allow us to recognize that we are here in reality are installed in us as infants and children. Once they are installed, they operate on the unconscious level, humming along, and we can never go back to not having them, unless we‟re in a profoundly altered state. For example, consider the notion of time. I distinctly remember being in first grade, when I was five or six years old, and finally being able to read a watch or clock. Do you remember when you 84

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

were first learning to read a watch or clock but had yet to get it? You were just learning to do it. There came a moment in time when you thought, “I get time. It‟s not eleventy-one. It‟s 11:01. It‟s not twelvety-thirty. How could it be that the hands on the 12 and six equals 12:30? It‟s a six, not a 30. I don‟t get it.” Then there came a moment when you did get it. Once you got the notion of telling time, you could never go back to not understanding it. Along with the notion of time come the notions of before, after and now. You‟re not born with that as a kid. Infants and toddlers don‟t inherently understand the notion of a past, present or future. They‟re totally in the now. That‟s why they crap their pants, among other things. They think, “It‟s fine. That‟s what I‟m doing now.” The notion of a future, present and past has to be acculturated into you, but once it is into you, it becomes a profound filter through which you see and structure everything you do. If you take that away from people, it‟s a profoundly altered state. They did some experiments. The book is called Training the Time Sense, and the guy‟s name is Robert Morgan. You guys, of all people, should have that book. One of the things they did in the experiments was train people to go very deeply into trance. Then they took away their sense of the past and future. The induction went along the lines of, “As that‟s happening, you notice that the future and past shrink into nothing, and the present moment expands to cover everything.”

85 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

When they did this, people lost all moral codes and restraints. They acted like children and did anything and everything they felt like. If you take away someone‟s past and future, everything becomes the present moment. Their moral behavior drops away. I‟m not suggesting that this is something that you should covertly learn to do, except on a date it might be fun. The way in which people experience and code time subjectively is a profoundly powerful building block for everything else they do. That‟s why it‟s one of the first things that is put into your head and acculturated into you through societal hypnosis. Fundamentally, your parents hypnotized you to buy into a world model that doesn‟t exist in reality. If you think about it, there‟s no such thing as a minute. Minutes don‟t exist the way an element on the periodic table exists, although we use numbers to do it. Do minutes or inches exist? Don‟t go there. The woman said yes. Inches don‟t exist. They‟re a form of measurement. Which one is real, a meter or a yard? Neither. Do you also remember when you were children that one of the first things you learned to do was measure things? I distinctly remember trying to learn how to use a ruler. I wound up drawing on it. Think about being able to measure things. There‟s no such thing as an inch. It‟s a societal construct that is useful. Why is it useful for you to be able to measure things? It‟s necessary for building things or drawing a line between your property and mine. You were conditioned as a kid to learn this.

86 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

What‟s another way we learn to measure things? When you were growing up, did you ever put a line on the wall to see how you were growing? Of course, I drew my lines with crayon. I got smacked around a lot, but I deserved it. I didn‟t really get smacked around a lot. Don‟t write to me and say, “Ross confesses to being smacked a lot.” I was smacked an appropriate amount. A year or so before my mother died, she and I were driving to see my brother, and we were talking. I said, “Mom, why did you from time to time hit us kids?” She said, “I always felt horrible hitting you kids, but it took a lot of courage.” I said, “What are you talking about? You were three times our size.” She said, “I always felt horrible afterwards, but I just didn‟t know what to do.” I said, “Wow.” Then she looked at me with a little gleam in her eye and used my real name. She said, “Paul, in any other family, you would have been beaten to death.” There is no such thing as an inch for real. It‟s a construct, but you buy into it. That construct enables you to conduct commerce. How much thread are you going to need for that dress? How much carpet do you need? Society has to acculturate you into it, and once it does, you see everything through that filter. It‟s the same thing with your sense of time and the number zero. I know someone whose work I respect. He talks about how the Hopi language has no words for time. At the same time, the Hopi had to understand time or they couldn‟t have planted their crops. They had to know the cycles of where the moon was and when to harvest or plant.

87 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Think about the notion of zero. What is zero fundamentally? What does zero enable you to do? The mathematician back there says “decimal calculations.” It is a reference point that enables you to do banking because without zero, you can't keep places. Zero is a place holder. It is not a number. It‟s a place holder for any of the other nine digits you put in there. That enables you to do banking and keep accounts. It also enables you to have negative numbers, so you can say, “You owe me. Your account shows -150 drachmas.” Without zero, we couldn‟t have banking. Without banking, we couldn‟t have debt. Think about that. Some cultures never came up with zero. The Romans never had it, so the Romans didn‟t have banking. They had trade and money, but they didn‟t have banking. What does debt enable you to do? I‟m not going to argue in favor or against it, but it enables you to temporarily borrow against future productivity so you can take risks that other societies can‟t. Often the risks get us into trouble. Think about the notion of zero. Many cultures didn‟t have it, but somewhere, some guy had to think, “Zero! I get it.” Then he taught other people. I‟m willing to bet that the structures and circuitry in the brain to grasp zero were there for 30,000 years before someone came up with it. Once it did, it changed consciousness. Once you understand telling time, you can never go back to not getting what a watch does, unless you‟re really piss-face drunk.

88 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

This is a serious point. In order to throw these constructs off, you have to really alter your reality. You have to get completely bombed out of your head to temporarily get rid of these concepts. These concepts operate on the unconscious level and structure how we even know that we‟re awake, alive and moving in the world. I fairly frequently have semi-lucid dreams where I‟ll think, “Wait a minute. This is really a dream. I don‟t believe it.” The people in my dream will say, “It‟s real. Stop joking around. You‟re always around.” I‟ll say, “If it‟s real, what‟s five times five?” When I dream, my mathematical mind is shut down completely. I can‟t do even the simplest calculations. Then I wake up because I know it‟s a dream. The point is that our ability to count, conceptualize numbers and measure and our sense of time are part of our everyday construct of reality. That‟s what boots up and is part of how we know, “Here‟s myself.” That stuff boots up and is ready to be used. My other point is that the circuitry to understand this was there for probably thousands of years before someone thought of it. Fire is another one. When we discovered fire and were able to take it into the cave, what did that enable us to do? We were able to stay awake longer and not have to go to sleep. That gave us a lot of spare time to develop art and culture. They found a 35,000-year-old flute. I read this in the paper three or four days ago. They said it was part of a culture that danced around the fire, drank beer and had music. The concepts that I‟m introducing to you, like fractionation, metastating, and the notion that you can manage and train people‟s 89 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

unconscious minds on how they reflect on the feelings that you‟re helping them to create, are as fundamentally transformative to your consciousness when it comes to persuading as the other ideas. They will become eventually part of the building blocks of your persuasion reality. Once you get it, you can never go back to not getting it. Once you see it, you can never go back to blinding yourself. You will see it and be able to use it. All the circuitry in your mind to grasp this is already there. You just have to activate it. That‟s my job as a teacher. Here‟s one reason why I am optimistic. I may not be optimistic about the next 100 years but eventually optimistic. If you think about it, the circuitry to understand zero was probably there for 10,000 or 20,000 years before the first guy got it. I believe that the circuitry to solve all the problems that we‟re facing in this world is already there in the human mind. We just have to learn to activate it and move in that direction. That‟s my little talk this morning. The other point is that the way in which people structure their reality is fundamentally subjective. The operating system that boots up and tells people, “Here I am. I am in a room. I am me,” is fundamentally subjective anyway. It has been acculturated in. If you want to talk about people not being subject to persuasion, look at that persuasion. Fundamentally, your views of how everything works were persuaded into you by powerful authority figures, the adults around you and probably your older siblings, who

90 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

you had no ability to resist. If you don‟t think you‟ve been the subject of some major life-altering persuasion, you‟re very wrong. If you‟re reading a clock, telling time, keeping appointments, measuring things, have a sense of past, present and future, have ever done a calculation involving the number zero, guess what? You were deeply programmed to get those concepts and to believe that they were real. I want to briefly review what we learned yesterday, and then we‟ll start getting to the workshop stuff. I want to again remind you that everyone here is strongly encouraged to participate in the workshops in the sense that if you have a question, comment or suggestion, raise your hand and I‟ll call on you. I want you to participate and contribute.

91 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 11 Being Artfully Vague and Establishing Authority Yesterday, I talked about being artfully vague. I said that when you‟re

vague,

it

creates

a

blank

in

the

other

person‟s

consciousness. They have to fill in that blank. The felt sense when you fill in the blank for yourself is that it is your own idea. One of the things you‟re going to be seeing in the workshops is how I direct people when to be vague and when to be specific. Often in a persuasion, one of the big problems is that people are being too specific too often, soon or intensely. This is one of the biggest problems. They‟re being too specific prior to establishing their authority in the other person‟s world and giving the person a sense that they‟re deeply understood. One of the purposes of being vague is to give the perception that you have a deep understanding of the other person‟s world. Do you remember I said that people will only perceive you‟re an authority on where they should go and what they should do if they first perceive that you are an authority on where they are at? One of the huge tools for doing that is being vague. Another tool for doing that is pacing the person‟s ongoing observable reality. I want to talk to you, particularly if you‟re dealing with people face to face, about pacing the other person‟s ongoing reality and their sense of who they are and what‟s important to them. Let me give you some specific examples of that. It‟s very important to do. Here are the different ways you can pace. I want you to take 92 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

notes, but first look at me. Look at me, let me give you the transmission, and then you can write it word for word, I promise you. What I‟d like you to write first is a big thing on the page that says, “Establishing authority.” By authority, I want to make clear that I don‟t mean a gun. Sorry, guys. I actually think the world is far too violent. Part of making you more persuasive is enabling you to get what you want without being violent or using coercion. What are some of the ways to establish authority? One is to use vague language to give people the sense that they‟re understood. You now all understand how that works. As you sit there listening to me and find yourself getting really excited about what you‟d like to learn about the applications of establishing authority, I‟m not sure just which imagery or thoughts come most strongly to mind. When you find yourself getting excited, my interest is to make sure you do that for all your own right reasons, not because of any of the ones I suggested, but because of the ones that make such profound sense to you.” I didn‟t say anything specific, did I? Did you get a sense that, “Wow! He really understands what I want to learn”? A second way to establish authority in the person‟s world is to pace. You can pace their ongoing behavior that you can observe. For example, if I was going to pace Yohav, I would say, “Yohav, as you sit there writing notes, listening to me and being very aware of the fact that you‟re paying attention…” I‟m making true statements 93 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

about what I can observe about him. He is sitting there, so it takes the form of “as you.” Any kind of pacing, generally speaking, starts with “as you.” You‟re making an observation about their ongoing behavior. You can pace their ongoing behavior. “You‟re sitting there listening to me talk. You‟re talking notes and hearing yourself thinking as you listen to what it is I say.” I‟m pacing what‟s going on. You can pace the ongoing behavior that you observe. It takes the form of “as you,” and then you describe what you see. I would not say, “Yoav, as you stand there and wave your arms about and listen to the „Star-Spangled Banner‟ while drawing on your notepad,” because he‟s not doing that. It‟s very easy to do. You can pace the observable reality that you see the person going through. That‟s the easiest thing to do. Participant:

Is that like mirroring?

Ross:

Mirroring is physical behavior. Pacing is you observe what the person is doing and describe it to them. I‟m accurately describing what I observe from you. If you do three pacing statements and then introduce a suggestion, the suggestion is going to go in because the person says, “Yes. Yes. Yes.” Forget about the Yes Ladder, I want you to establish Yes Momentum, an internal yes. They‟re not saying yes out loud. When I say, “You‟re sitting there,” your response is, “Yes, I am.” “And you‟re listening to me.” “Yes, I am.” “And you‟re looking at me.” “Yes, I am.” Forget about the Yes Ladder and establish what I 94

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

call “Yes Momentum.” Yes Momentum is the internal, subjective experience of the other person saying “yes, yes, yes” in their mind. “You‟re sitting there looking at me. You‟re listening to what I have to say and having certain thoughts.” What you can do is start with three statements that are an obvious pacing of their external reality. Then you can add in a suggestion. “As you sit there and look at me and listen to what I say, I‟m not sure how intrigued you find yourself becoming.” Now you start to suggest something with “how intrigued you find yourself becoming.” You see the structure of this. You make three statements about what you see, and the fourth one is your suggestion. This is a classical hypnotic technique of pacing people‟s ongoing reality. It‟s very simple. Pacing people‟s fears, failures and frustrations by describing them is the next technique. You can also pace their dreams, desires, wants, needs and fantasies. Let me give you where this is useful and how you do it. Has anyone here ever read any of my Speed Seduction® sales letters? Participants:

Yes.

Ross:

When you read them, did you get a sense that I was inside your reality, describing it to you?

Participants:

Yes.

95 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I talk about, “Doesn‟t it really suck when you hear, „Let‟s just be friends?‟ or you have to settle for women that you can accidentally get, not the ones you really want. I know, good buddy. I‟ve been there. “Nina was a girl I pined after. I used to dream of that beautiful ass. Time and again, she would complain to me about the guy she was really attracted to. She would always end it by saying, ‟I appreciate what a great friend you are.‟ Damn, I‟m sure you‟ve been there! I hate that.” If you can accurately describe the person‟s problem, fear, failure or frustration, they will assume you have the solution. In fact, the person describing the problem often has no solution. Fifty percent of medicine works that way. The doctor says, “Here‟s what‟s wrong with you,” and describes it really well, but he has no solution. Has anyone ever read The Diagnostic Service Manual, DSM4? They‟ll describe the syndrome. “Your child has oppositional defiant disorder.” What is oppositional defiant disorder? The kid doesn‟t want to clean up her room. They medicalize and pathologize everything. They give fancy labels and seem to describe the behavior accurately. “The kids displays behaviors 1, 2, 3, 4, 5.” You think, “Oh yes, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. It must be the case that my kid is that, and therefore this pill that will fry their neurology must be the answer. He must have the answer because he described the problem.” People will make that logical leap. It‟s what I call “junkologic.” If you can describe in your sales piece, summation or argument and demonstrate that you understand people‟s fears, failures or 96

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

frustrations, they will assume you have the answers to those fears, failures and frustrations. Sometimes you don‟t want to go there. Sometimes you want to lead with a description of their desires, dreams or fantasies. That‟s something else I do in my Speed Seduction® material. I talk about the fantasies. I‟ll say, “Imagine this. You wake up and there next to you, she‟s still sleeping, that absolute stunning beauty who just enjoyed a night of passion with you where she gave everything she had and was crying out with pleasure. Think of all the things you enjoyed with her. You sigh to yourself as you realize this is not the first or the only. This is just one of many similarly beautiful experiences you‟ve had over the last six months of mastering this material.” The other thing you can do is describe the fantasy. Describe their hopes, dream and desires. You can do it in a truism. “Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, we all long for a fair world. We long for a world in which we see justice done.” Point to yourself as you describe common truisms. What are some common truisms? “Honesty is the best policy,” even though no one really follows it. “A cheater never prospers.” That‟s not true. You can use truisms or universalisms. What do most men want? They want control and predictability when it comes to women. Even if they don‟t want a lot of women, they want to know that if they want a woman, they can get her without guesswork. 97 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

One of the fundamental selling points of Speed Seduction®, whether you believe it or not, is it takes the guesswork and begging out of it. You can pace people‟s fears, fantasies and frustrations either by describing them accurately or using a metaphor. One of the things I love to do when I persuade is say that dating is a form of gambling. You instantly understand what I mean. You‟re rolling the dice hoping to get lucky. You can metaphorically describe people‟s fears, failures or frustrations. You can describe them directly by saying, “Doesn‟t it suck when that girl says, „I just want to be friends,‟ and you‟ve been into her for months? Don‟t you just feel crushed?”

98 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 12 Metaphors You can describe it accurately and also use metaphor. Metaphor is really powerful because it goes straight to the unconscious mind and creates a canopy of consciousness. I do it all the time in my sales letters. I should print one out tomorrow and read it to you so you get it. You go to my website, www.Seduction.com, and read my product sales letters. Then I also say, “But now imagine this,” and I describe what you‟ve been through. There‟s that beautiful girl, blah, blah, blah. You can say, “Isn‟t that being specific?” I‟m not too specific. I‟m just describing a very common male fantasy of being with a beautiful woman. I‟m not saying what she looked like. I‟m not saying she has blond hair and blue eyes. I‟m specific enough to identify the fantasy, but I keep it general enough so they will identify with the fantasy. “There she is. You wake up next to her. She‟s absolutely stunning.” I‟m specific enough to identify the fantasy, but I‟m general enough so that they fill in the details in the fantasy. You can do this with wants, hopes and fears. You can also do it with fears, failures and frustration. Then I add in metaphor. I use dating is a form of gambling. You instantaneously identify what I mean. When I say dating is a form of gambling, whether you agree with me or not, in what way would you say dating is a form of gambling? Participant:

You don‟t know the outcome.

99 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s right. You don‟t know what the outcome will be. You‟re playing the odds. If you‟re asking how to find the metaphors that will best describe the fears, failures, frustrations or hopes, dreams, wishes and fantasies, just look at common language. Common language will tell you. It‟s rolling the dice. I got lucky. It‟s a numbers game. Men are already using that metaphor to describe getting with women. Whether or not you‟re interested in getting with women is not the point. I‟m using it as an illustration. The formula is you can describe what the fears, failures, frustrations, fantasies, hopes or desires are. You can identify them without getting too specific. Fundamentally, what you‟re selling is not bath salts, cream or beauty necessarily. You‟re selling indulgences, people doing something indulgent for themselves. That‟s what you‟re really selling. As soon as you get that, your business will transform. I would have your people start out by saying, “Excuse me. You look like the kind of person who loves to do something really great for yourself. Come here.” Ask, “When was the last time you really treated yourself to something? Let me show you something. “I don‟t know if that‟s for you, but do you like to feel good soaking in the tub? Do you like to feel good when your face feels clean and young because you‟ve used something that makes you feel beautiful no matter who you‟re around and what you‟re doing?” Then point to the product.

100 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

The five paragraphs and, “This comes from the Dead Sea.” No one wants to know unless they‟re geologists. You just got your money‟s worth. Come up with metaphors. Think, “Here‟s my audience. In need to identify the fear, failure and frustration. How can I identify it so they know what I‟m talking about and perceive that I know what I‟m talking about, but not be so specific that I use details that don‟t match?” Then throw in metaphors. You say it‟s a form of gambling. You‟re rolling the dice. Politicians use this all the time. Whether or not you agree with their policies, I‟m not talking about that. It‟s about whether they‟re a good persuader. Whether or not you like President Obama, that man knew how to persuade. His marketing team brought in $950 Million in contributions over the internet. The champion internet marketer, my friends, is Barak Obama and his team of people. They knew how to market on the internet. Those people never even got a shirt or button. They just gave him the money because they felt like they were participating in a dream. Whether or not you agree with President Obama is not the point. The point is it was brilliant marketing because he knew how to identify with people‟s hopes and frustrations. He did both. He knew how to install a sense of hope and how to use metaphor. He could identify the problem without being so descriptive that it didn‟t match. We‟re all struggling. Struggling in what way? And then he would give specific examples like the mother who doesn‟t have

101 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

healthcare or the son who can‟t go to college. Everyone in the audience would agree. He didn‟t give so much detail that it didn‟t match. He didn‟t say, “The son who can‟t get into USC because of this and this.” He gave enough so you felt he was identifying it without describing it so accurately that you couldn‟t match it to yourself. The next thing you do is come up with a metaphor. Sit down and look at their area of life and think what the common metaphors are. What are the common metaphors when you think about making a good decision? What are the common metaphors that the ethnic group or demographic you‟re addressing use and believe in? That‟s another way to establish authority in the world of the people you want to address. What‟s the first technique? It‟s pacing the ongoing observable reality. What was the second technique? Be artfully vague. What‟s the third technique? Identify the fear, failure, frustration, desire, hope, need, wish or want. Describe it enough so that they get it, but not with so much specificity that it doesn‟t match. That‟s a really good art form. That could be an entire day of teaching. Any one of these is powerful. When you combine all of them, people say, “He or she must be someone worth listening to.” Do we have any questions about this? I could break you up into a little workshop right now. We could take half a day coming up with examples. This tells me in an advanced version of this program, that‟s what I‟ll do. I will create a tape series establishing authority and show you all the ways to do it. We had a question.

102 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Brock:

It‟s common in sales and copywriting to know you can get people‟s attention using negative images.

Ross:

I‟m going to stop you here. Whenever I hear the word “negative,” I reach for my gun because I don‟t know what it means. What do you mean by negative? New Age people, when I point out the flaws and errors in their philosophy, they say, “You‟re negative.” My idea is, “No, I‟m clear, and you‟re a fool.” I‟m not saying that to you, but what do you mean by “negative”?

Brock:

I guess I would define “negative” as something that makes you contract, like a fear, failure or frustration.

Ross:

Often, you can start with that. I do it in my headlines.

Brock:

Do you want to follow that same pattern throughout the sales letter you‟re selling on something positive? You might start with negative.

Ross:

I can‟t tell you which one you should start with. I can tell you that you use both. You want to pull people toward something, and you also want to push them away from something. You need to give them a kick in the ass and put a ring in their nose. You need to do both to make sure you cover your bases, particularly if you don‟t know your audience face to face. If someone is reading a sales letter that‟s going out to 1 million people, there is going to be some minority of those people who only move toward what they want. There will be some people who only move away from what they want and don‟t listen to the positive reward. Eighty-five percent of the people are going to be motivated by both.

103 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

The question is not which you start with. It depends artistically how you feel and what the issue is. The point is that you want to use both. Are there any questions so far about establishing authority? Participant:

When you‟re dealing with authorities, and you want to convince them that you have the solution to their rhetoric, they‟re the ones who make the rules. How do they take authority from you when they have the authority?

Ross:

Give me a specific. That‟s too vague. I‟m visualizing something, but I don‟t know if it‟s what you mean.

Participant:

For instance, at one time Governor Schwarzenegger said he wanted to pass a law reducing emissions by 22%. The federal government EPA sued him saying that was impossible. It was 20 years out.

Ross:

This is an exception. When you‟re dealing with a bureaucracy with structural rules, it‟s a completely different game. Within that game, you can still play. But if there‟s structural rules and bureaucracies, that‟s a different kind of thing.

Participant:

But it‟s rampant throughout the whole thing. Everywhere I read, it says, “We want this.”

Ross:

How does that apply to your own specific persuasion challenge?

Participant:

My perspective is that I have the solution for what they are looking for.

Ross:

You have the solution for what they‟re looking for. That‟s a matter of finding the right people and convincing them. 104

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

They don‟t want to be convinced.

Ross:

Or you don‟t know how to do it or both.

Participant:

Exactly.

Ross:

That‟s a different issue. I‟m going to show you one more thing. Then we‟re going to break up. We have time for all the workshop people. Don‟t worry about it. Stealing the Authority of Others There‟s one more sneaky way to establish authority. I don‟t know if I want to say to establish authority. In a sense, you are establishing authority. That way is to steal the authority of others. “Steal” is such a bad word because when you take something, it means they don‟t have any left. You can borrow the authority of others. We see examples of this in celebrity endorsements. If Kobe Bryant endorsed athletic shoes, they‟d fly out the door. What does Kobe endorse?

Participant:

Nike.

Ross:

That‟s worth a lot because people take the adoration and admiration they have for Kobe, and they transfer it to the shoe. Let‟s say you were trying to sell to Evangelical Christians, and you really could get Jesus Christ to endorse your product. There‟s a commercial that says, “Hi, I‟m Jesus Christ, and I like this Bible so much. First of all, I wrote it and every word is true. You can trust these people. Buy it today.”

105 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I don‟t mean to offend anybody. I apologize if I have, but think about it. The orders would fly out the door because you take the authority and believability of the celebrity, and you glom it onto the product. The old model of advertising used to be interruption. You‟re being entertained, and then they interrupt you to shove an ad down your throat. Now they know that doesn‟t work so they try to sneak it in. Have you ever watched “Smallville”? I love that show. Clark Kent is eating Sugar Pops. They take the product and it becomes part of the background of the show. It slides past resistance. Obviously, you probably aren‟t going to get Kobe Bryant to endorse your products, but there are some sneaky tricky ways around it. One of the things you can do is if you‟re in a board meeting, you can steal the body language, inflection and gestures of the person who is obviously in charge. Unconsciously, people will then associate that authority to you. If you‟re sitting in a board meeting, and you observe that the president or head of the company taps his pencil in a certain rhythm, you don‟t want to tap the pencil. That‟s too obvious. You can tap your finger or something else. This is not mirroring. It‟s stealing the other person‟s gestures, emblems or emblematic gestures. There is one guy whose tapes I‟ve been listening to. It‟s not Shinzen, but somebody else. I notice that when he says a concept that he thinks is really good, he says, “Mm.” When I meet him, I‟m going to say, “I have an idea for you. Mm.”

106 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I‟m going to repeat his thing that lets him know it‟s a good idea. You can watch to see how the person in authority does his verbal expression, other than words, that shows he agrees. You just repeat those back every so often when you‟re addressing the group. The other thing you can do is borrow his emblem. What does that mean? Let‟s say he leaves the room for some reason. Get up and sit down in his chair. Don‟t sit down in his chair. That‟s a sign of disrespect. Stand behind his chair and say, “Here‟s what I think.” If you sit down in his chair, it‟s too aggressive. If you stand behind his chair, now you‟re in his position of authority. Here‟s another thing you could do to convince a jury. That wouldn‟t be useful, would it? Let‟s say the judge has a particular sound he makes when he‟s expressing agreement or disagreement. The judge has some noise he makes, like, “Hm.” Borrow it when you address the jury. Juries may not believe the lawyers. Generally speaking, they look at the judge with high respect. See if the judge has any kind of small mannerism you can borrow. I‟m borrowing something from someone‟s work. You don‟t want to do the full mannerism because you will get caught by the jury or the judge, and he won‟t like it. You can do a portion of the mannerism, like one-third or one-fourth of it. Unconsciously, the people will begin to associate you with the same authority as the judge. Is that fair? Not if you‟re prosecuting me, which will never happen.

107 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

You can use this all the time. I teach this in a seduction way. When I teach Speed Seduction®, I tell the guys, “Women have what I call self-anchors.” Have you ever said to a woman, “Tell me about the first time you fell in love.” She goes, “Ah!.” What is she doing? She‟s accessing the feeling flowing in her body that lets her know she‟s in love. I‟ll just repeat that. Later in the evening, I‟ll say, “I‟m having such a good time, ah!” I don‟t even have to do the whole thing. I‟ll just do a part of it, like one-third of it, and she goes into the state. You also watch for the other person‟s self-anchors, the sounds or gestures they make when they‟re having a positive emotion, and you fire it off just before or as you‟re talking about what you want them to believe. If you train your salespeople to watch and say, “You look like someone who really wants to do something wonderful for yourself,” and they go, “Hm,” that‟s their sign that accesses the feeling. From time to time, your employees should repeat that subtly whenever they touch the product. “Have a look at this, hm.” They‟re going to associate that feeling with a product. How do you know? That‟s what they do to get in that state. Participant:

Can you do it with the same tone?

Ross:

Close, but mirroring is bullshit because people will pick it up. Do it just one-third of what they do. Use one-third or one-half of their emphasis or volume. Experiment with it. Some people need the full thing because you really need to wake them up.

108 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Cognitive Momentum and Emotional Inertia When people tend to make decisions or enter strong flows of feeling, generally speaking, they‟ll make some subtle gesture, expression and/or sound that tell them, “Turn it on.” That‟s their way of pushing the button. Here‟s the beauty of it. When they push that button, it engages a flow of feelings and a train of thought and visualization that takes on its own momentum. Why does it take on its own momentum? It‟s happened so many times before that it has what I call cognitive momentum and emotional inertia. If you do that little bit, you fire it off, and they‟re going to engage in the whole thing. Participant:

I understand cognitive momentum, but I don‟t understand emotional inertia.

Ross:

I was talking with my friends about how it is possible that people keep repeating their patterns of behavior when they really do want to change. Is it that some part of them wants to sabotage? Have you ever heard this notion, “You‟re sabotaging yourself. A part of you doesn‟t want this.” That‟s bullshit. It‟s almost always bullshit. The process by which old patterns of behavior and thinking come up is simply that they‟ve done it so many times that they have their own momentum now. They‟re moving on their own because they‟ve done it so many times. Here‟s a metaphor. See how I used metaphor? First I gave a general description of the problem, enough so that you could identify with it, but not so specific that you misidentify. 109

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

It‟s like a train. Imagine a train that weights 100,000 tons, and it‟s only going one mile per hour. If you threw on the brakes, it would be pretty easy to stop that train. The same train weighs the same amount. Now it‟s going 150 miles an hour. You have to throw on the brakes a lot harder. Why? It has been moving and accelerating. If someone has a pattern with a lot of emotional charge, and they‟ve done it many times, by sheer force of that repetition, it has momentum. It doesn‟t even have to add anything in to be going fast. If you cut the motor on that train, it will still be going with a lot of force for quite some time. Here‟s the key thing. When people reveal to you those little things, those little sounds, facial gestures or noises they make will engage those patterns that have the emotional momentum and cognitive components that you want, fantasize and desire. It sets in motion a chain reaction of things. You may have to reinforce it and likely you do. Another thing you can do is steal the anchors of an authority figure who they all believe in. We could do a day or hours on each one of these techniques. Let me give you an example. Does anyone remember the first O.J. Simpson trial? Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

Again, I‟m not saying anything about what‟s right or what‟s wrong. I‟m simply talking about what is effective. Why do you think Johnny

110 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Cochran was so effective? Among other reasons, he did something extremely clever. Do you know what he did? Some people say, “He played the race card.” He did, but he also played the race card in a more subtle way. He played it in an obvious way, and he played it in a subtle way that nobody caught. Here‟s what he did. If you can find videos of that trial, it was televised, right? One of the things you‟ll notice is when Johnnie Cochran spoke to the jury, not the judge and not when he interviewed witnesses, he had a different cadence. He also had a completely different rhythm and posture than when he spoke to the judge or to others. He took on all of the gestures, cadence and rhythm of a Sunday morning preacher. The majority of people on that jury, I mean no offense, were urban, black Americans who were churchgoers. They believed in that stuff and watched those shows. When Johnny Cochran took on the cadence, rhythm and voice inflections of a preacher when he talked to the audience, unconsciously they were thinking, "He‟s a man of God. I must believe him." It was very clever. Notice the cadence, rhythm, gestures and tonality of some person or authority figure that the people you want to influence, whatever their demographics, believe in and hold in high esteem. In a sense, you‟re stealing that person‟s authority.

111 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Johnnie Cochran stole, borrowed, or took on the mantle or cloak of authority of someone who those people had trained themselves or were trained to deeply trust to tell the truth. Could that be useful? If we had time, we could practice each one of these concepts for an hour or two. What I‟m going to do at some point is an advanced training where we unpack each of these concepts that I‟m reviewing. We‟ll spend half a day on each one so you get good at this stuff. Everyone here will be receiving a complete transcript, as well as the CDs and DVDs. I‟m not promising, but what I‟m also conceptualizing for each of these concepts is an online module or co-creating an online course. I‟ve given you five different ways to establish authority in someone‟s world. Personally one of my favorite things, aside from being vague, is using metaphor. See if you can identify the common metaphors of the people you want to influence and use those metaphors. Of all of the things, only fractionation excites me as much as metaphor because metaphor is profoundly powerful. You could say there are elements of consciousness in the various things we visualize and say to ourselves. If these are the elements of consciousness, metaphor creates a canopy of consciousness, underneath which all of these take place. That canopy affects all of them. The metaphor that you buy into will affect what you visualize and how you visualize it. It will affect what you say to yourself and what flow of feelings you turn on and turn off. Metaphors are profoundly powerful. I could spend a day on metaphors. 112 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

You need to look at your own metaphors, too. They will set you free. Your metaphor might be, "Business is a jungle.” If you are interpreting business that way, what do you think that‟s going to do in terms of your ability to find cooperative partners whom you stay in long-term cooperation with in a way that serves both of you? Do you think it‟s going to make it difficult or easy to do that? Not only will it make it difficult, it will shut you out from even looking for that or conceptualizing that something is possible. “Love is a battlefield.” Is that a good metaphor to hold? If it‟s not, then why do they allow people to put songs in the air that hammer that into our minds constantly? I love my girlfriend dearly, but I can‟t stand her music. I tell her, "You‟re not going to play that in my house. Put on headphones." She likes to go out drinking at night with her Swedish girlfriends. The Swedes are interesting. If they‟re going out at 9:00 at night, at 7:30 they start drinking to get ready as they‟re putting on their makeup and playing their music. She plays music I hate. There‟s this awful song that my girlfriend loves. She plays it over and over but I say, "No! Put on headphones or go in the other room with that shit." That‟s a primary female fantasy, the guy who never settles down. He has a lot of women, but somehow through the power of her love, she tames him and breaks through. He falls in love with her and only her.

113 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

You‟re listening to this stuff, but talk about brainwashing! It‟s constantly being bombarded in your head. Almost every song works through metaphor. Songs don‟t literally describe what happened. "I met you. We made out. I touched your whatever, then we humped, and then that was it." No one describes what happens. Songs use metaphor. We‟re constantly bombarded by metaphor. He who controls the metaphor, controls the thought, the conversation, and the outcome. Watch the metaphors that you use on yourself. See if you can ferret out the common metaphors that your demographic or your subjects, or whoever you‟re going to address, use because if you use those metaphors and the other side doesn‟t, then they‟re going to identify with you. Not only that, if the other side starts to try to use them, then they look like copycats of you. Use the metaphors first. Participant:

For those who are not English majors, what‟s a good way to develop the talent of being able to tell metaphors?

Ross:

Any time you hear someone singing, “I was commander in chief of this pimp ship,” you should think, "Is that literally true? Did he have a pimp ship? Was he commander in chief?" That‟s one way to hear it‟s not a literal description. Whenever you hear “like,” you know it‟s a metaphor. "It‟s just like…" or "Love is like a rose. You can smell it and touch it, but sooner or later it will shrivel in your hand," or whatever it is. Any time you hear “X is like Y,” you‟re hearing a metaphor. That‟s one way.

114 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Stories are metaphors. Politicians use metaphors all the time. “It‟s a new day in America.” What does that mean? What do you envision? When that politician says, "It‟s a new day in America," what do you envision? It‟s the sun coming up and the start of hope. No, it‟s not a new day in America, it‟s the same old shit happening over and over. I‟m sorry to be cynical. I‟m just pointing out what‟s really going on. But people want you to believe. If you buy into that metaphor, then everything that you‟re told will slide into that metaphor or be bounced out if it doesn‟t fit. Metaphors are extraordinarily powerful. The metaphors you tell yourself usually operate outside your conscious awareness. You seldom express them often. You‟ll think it, but you don‟t really think, "Wait a minute. That‟s not literally true." Love is a battlefield. Business is a war. Life is a game. If you know the metaphors about people you want to influence, use them. What I want to talk about, workshop, and do exercises and drills on is this notion of establishing authority in the world of the people who you would like to influence.

115 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 13 Four Methods for Establishing Authority (Drill Exercise) I outlined three or four different methods for establishing authority in the world of the people who you wish to influence. Let‟s start dealing with them. Let‟s review. First, pace the observable, ongoing reality of the person whom you‟re addressing. I‟ll tell you a story. I said that you can pace their ongoing, observable reality, but you can also pull their metaphors out of their heads. I did it with this gentleman. Did you see his state change when I said Da Vinci? That was a major knockout hit. I saw Da Vinci with a picture of the Mona Lisa in my head, so that‟s what I knew to say. I pulled it out of his head. If you can get close to their metaphor, it‟s tremendous power. That‟s like all the buttons go, "Bam!" Everything else gets pushed. Not only can you pace their observable behavior but if you‟re good, you can pace their internal processing. Let me give you an example of that. A couple of years back, I was hanging out with my friend, Dr. Ken. Dr. Ken is an Asian lover. He likes Asian girls, so I took him to this place near UCLA where I knew a lot of Asian girls were studying. We went to the counter and ordered our food. It‟s the kind of place where you order food at the counter, then bring it back to your table when it‟s ready. They call you and you bring it back. Sitting over at a table I saw a very attractive Asian girl. She turned out to be Chinese. I thought, "We‟re going to go sit at the table next

116 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

to her." We sat at the table next to her to wait for our food. I was sitting here, Dr. Ken was facing me, and she was sitting behind me. I noticed that she had a big, thick book she was studying. It was like she was talking to herself in her head. We sat down and I winked at Ken and said, "Watch this." I turned around and said, "Excuse me. Could you please not think too loudly? You look like a very loud thinker and we have something we‟re discussing. Thank you very much," and I turned back around. A second later, I felt a tap on my shoulder and she said, "Who are you?" because I was pacing the fact that she was talking to herself in her head. It wasn‟t that difficult to see. It didn‟t take any psychic power. It was just a matter of simple observation to see what she was doing on the inside. If someone is doing this kind of sub-vocalizing, what are they doing? Maybe they‟re hearing voices, I don‟t know. This is Los Angeles. That was a matter of me humorously pacing her ongoing internal process, but you can‟t always spot that. DRILL EXERCISE Let‟s do a little drill in pacing the other person‟s observable reality. Here‟s what we‟re going to do. We‟re going to break up into pairs of people, person A and person B. Person A, you‟re going to observe person B. Based on what you see them doing, you‟re going to make three statements that pace their ongoing reality. For example, if I was pacing you, I would say you‟re sitting there, looking at me with your hands folded against your leg. It‟s that simple. That‟s all we‟re going to do. 117 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

First divide up into twos, person A and person B, and then switch. Person A, you‟re going to look at person B and make three statements that pace their reality. Then you‟re going to switch. That‟s all we‟re going to do for the next 10 minutes, and then I‟ll build a piece onto that. We just did a little drill. Does anyone want to report on their experience? Were you able to do it? Who was able to do this drill successfully? Who was your person B that you did it with? Drill Exercise Results Participant:

Mine was Mark.

Ross:

Mark, did he pace your reality properly? Did he do it well?

Mark:

Yes.

Ross:

Were you able to pace him?

Mark:

Yes, so much so that we just did one or two rounds and we hadn‟t really talked at all before. Then we just turned and got into a deep conversation.

Ross:

Were you able to do it and who did you work with?

Participant:

Yes, I was.

Participant:

He worked with me.

Ross:

Did he pace you well?

Participant:

Yes, we were interacting. He did it once. I did it once. It worked fine.

118 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

The next step, now that you‟ve paced the other person, is to add a suggestion. An example would be, “You‟re looking at me and you‟re listening to what I have to say. You‟re thinking certain thoughts and you‟re beginning to focus in on what it is you want to learn.” That was a suggestion, and you followed the first three. Remember I said forget about the Yes Ladder in business. “Mr. Jones, you like making money, don‟t you?" "Yes." "And you‟d like to secure the financial future of your family, wouldn‟t you?" Remember, I said to forget about the Yes Ladder. Instead you want an internal, not a Yes Ladder but an internal Yes Momentum. When you want to establish Yes Momentum, it‟s much different. They do it in their own head, “Yes, yes, yes.” There‟s another thing you can do when you offer the suggestion. You‟re sitting there, listening and looking at me. You‟re aware that there‟s something you want to learn. You see what I did, that slight little head nod? There‟s something you want to learn. Here‟s what I want you to do. The next assignment is to go back to the same partner and do your three pacing statements. Then offer a suggestion. I‟m going to show you how to structure that. When you offer the suggestion, you structure it like this. You‟re sitting there, you‟re looking at me, you‟re listening to what I have to say, and you‟re recognizing there‟s something you want to learn. You‟re

using

the

presupposition

of

awareness.

You‟re

recognizing, realizing and becoming aware of. Then tell them what they‟re becoming aware of. Help them realize that there‟s

119 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

something they want to learn and that they want to make a decision today. Use recognize, realize and becoming aware. You‟re looking at me. You‟re listening to what I have to say. You‟re sitting there, and you‟re becoming aware that there‟s a decision you‟d like to make today. You‟re becoming aware that you want to purchase something today. You‟re recognizing that there‟s something you want to buy today. Use recognize, realize and becoming aware. Then tell them what they are recognizing, what they are becoming aware of, and what they are realizing. Then you give them the command. The command is whatever you want them to realize, recognize or become aware of. What were some of the commands that you wound up giving? Participant:

It is not necessary to think that I‟m really smart.

Ross:

You‟re sitting there looking at me, aware of what I‟m saying, and it‟s not necessary to realize I‟m really smart, recognize I‟m really smart or think that I‟m really smart. Very good. Do you see how you‟re starting to use these tools naturally, easily, readily and immediately?

Participant:

My command after the three pacing statements was, “I don‟t know if you could become aware of how doing these exercises is making all this knowledge more real for you.”

Ross:

Oh, that‟s good! More real than what? I really like that.

120 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

One way to establish authority in the world of your subject or audience is by pacing their ongoing reality. I also said to bring up and mention their fears, failures and frustrations. Tomorrow we‟re going to get to their desires, dreams or fantasies. As a preview of what we‟re going to be doing together, let me ask you something. What is it that you think you‟re really selling? Participant:

What I think I‟m selling in the big sense is a feeling, a way that I help the people see themselves in a new way, younger and more confident.

Ross:

What are the three top fears, failures or frustrations of the people you‟re selling to?

Participant:

I‟d say aging, not looking good, and social confidence in the way they‟ll be seen.

Ross:

Who has a market they‟re trying reach? Who needs to learn to write a sales letter? What are the fears, failures and frustrations of the people you‟re addressing? I could name mine with my seduction students. They don‟t get any women, they only get the women who accidently like them, they get the women but not the ones who are in their league, or they have to go through painful, expensive rituals to get women. I know what their fears, failures and frustrations are, and therefore, I know what their fantasies are.

Participant:

One of them could be that the product or the service might be perceived to be too expensive.

Ross:

That‟s an objection, not a fear, failure or frustration. 121

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Honestly, I don‟t know.

Ross:

Do you know their desires, wishes or needs?

Participant:

They desire to be more efficient, save money, and be more connected with the people they love and want to be with. I don‟t know. I‟m not clear on that.

Ross:

No, you‟re not clear. It‟s something you need to find out. We said fears, failures and frustrations. What‟s another way to establish authority in the world of your prospect? Dreams, desires, and being artfully vague.

122 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 14 Drills on Being Artfully Vague Why don‟t we do some drills on being artfully vague? If you‟re going to start talking about being artfully vague, there are some phrases you can use to start things off. For example, let‟s say I want to give people a chain of commands. Let‟s play with two of my favorite phrases: “It‟s not important” and “I don‟t know.” Let‟s see what fun we can have with these two. Let‟s talk about the phrase, “It‟s not important.” “As you sit there looking at me, becoming aware of the fact that there‟s something you really want to learn today, it‟s not important that you go inside and find that in a way that feels absolutely natural, powerful and compelling to you. It‟s equally not important whether you feel yourself pulled forward by an incredible desire or pushed ahead by a driving need. “What‟s really important is that you recognize that that‟s the process of motivating yourself to move into action toward something you want for yourself.” Did I say anything? When I start out by saying, “It‟s not important,” it‟s powerful for a lot of reasons. When I say, “It‟s not important,” you‟re not going to resist it because it‟s not important. Have you ever heard someone say, “We need to talk. There‟s something very important we need to discuss”? What is your first response? Have you ever heard your girlfriend say, “We need to talk”? I‟ll say, “I do that better on a full stomach. Go make me a sandwich.”

123 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Have you ever heard this one? “Where‟s this relationship going?” “To the kitchen to make me dinner.” Score! “It‟s not important” tends to dissipate resistance because they‟ll think, “I can relax. It‟s not something big they‟re throwing at me.” Also, it‟s not important according to whom? According to whom is it not important and to whom is it not important? There‟s one ambiguity. Let‟s write down the ambiguities. “According to whom.” Learning this will also assist you in recognizing when someone is trying to pull the wool over your eyes. I have a detector in my head that picks up non-specified language. “It‟s not important.” According to whom is it not important? To whom is it not important? In what way or ways is it not important? Milton Erickson used to use this all the time. I have a poem, “Fascination,” that a student wrote and I rewrote. I like to read to women. One of the verses says, “It‟s not important that you find that all inhibitions are left behind.” It‟s not important, and when and where is it not important? There are four or five aspects of vagueness in those three words. When you say, “It‟s not important,” then you begin to describe what it is you want them to experience. I like to use it like this. “It‟s not important whether you X, Y or Z,” where X, Y and Z represent the three different internal processes and flows of thought you want them to engage in. Participant:

By general flows of thought do you mean primary states?

124 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

No. I just mean, “It‟s not important whether you go inside and tune into how excited you are about what you‟re learning, or whether you find yourself visualizing all the benefits you‟re going to get from learning this, or whether you can recognize rapidly how excited you are to be learning this in a way that makes sense to you. The way to structure this is to first start with the X, Y and Z. Say what the conclusions, ways of thinking and the filters are. Say what the conclusions are that you want people to draw about opening up to your message. “It‟s not important that you recognize how exciting it is to be learning new and empowering information, or whether you can focus in on how exciting it is to do that, or whether you just find yourself naturally realizing that this is something you want to do.” Think to yourself what the three major ways of thinking you want them to engage in are. For example, you can have them recognize the value of something, realize the excitement about recognizing it, and then come to the conclusion they reach from that. Generally I‟ll say something like, “It‟s not important” or “It doesn‟t matter.” “It doesn‟t matter” is just as good as “It‟s not important.” It‟s the same ambiguity. “It doesn‟t matter whether you tune in to how excited you are about what you‟re learning, or whether you find yourself getting really excited, or whether you recognize that that‟s the process of stepping into a whole new discovery or direction that you want to take for yourself.”

125 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

By the way, during the election, did you hear both guys talking about new directions? “America needs a big, new direction.” I thought, “Did they take my course?” Someone, give me your business, and I‟ll throw out specific examples. Participant:

Let‟s say somebody wants to buy a cream for their face.

Ross:

“As you‟re rubbing this cream on yourself, feeling how good it is against your skin and enjoying how great it smells, it doesn‟t matter whether you tune in to how much you‟re enjoying it now or whether you picture to yourself how much you‟ll enjoy it in private when there‟s no one around. “It doesn‟t matter whether you tune in and focus on how much you‟re going to enjoy giving this to someone else as a gift. I think what really matters is that you can find your own reasons to realize that this is something you want.” This is an example I‟m making up off the top of my head.

Participant:

It‟s covering all the possibilities.

126 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 15 Ideal Candidate Patterns Ross:

Challenge me. What‟s your business?

Participant:

Tequila sales.

Ross:

Tequila sales to businesses or to people? Are you a bartender, or what do you do?

Participant:

I do wholesale and import.

Ross:

I don‟t know how that would work with importing because I have no idea what the patter is there.

Participant:

It‟s actually selling to businesses.

Ross:

When you think about what it is you like and think about the ideal relationship you‟d like with a vendor, this is what you say to them. You‟re the distributor, and they‟re the vendor?

Participant:

I‟m the importer and the distributor to the distributors that distribute to the vendors.

Ross:

I‟m going to fill in the blanks for you, but I need to know what you describe yourself as. When you go to these people, are you the vendor? Are they the vendor? How do you describe yourself?

Participant:

I go to the distributors because I‟m the importer. Ideal Candidate Pattern #1

Ross:

You‟re the importer, so I would say, “When you stop and think about the ideal business relationship you want with the importer you can rely on, I‟m not sure just what you think about that lets you realize that that‟s who you‟re dealing with. 127

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“But as we‟re talking today, I just want to invite you to ask me anything you want because I think that‟s part of the process and an important part of the process of realizing there‟s something really good that you can do for your business today.” Participant:

That‟s really good.

Ross:

I know it‟s really good. Do you want me to go through it again?

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

“I don‟t know what it is that happens when you stop and you think about the ideal kind of business relationship you want with an importer. I also don‟t know what happens when you recognize that that‟s what‟s taking place. “What I do want to tell you is that as we‟re talking today, it‟s important if you have any questions or challenges at all, that you let me know what they are. I think that‟s part of the process of recognizing that you‟re making a really good decision for your business.” What does that cause them to do? It causes them to think of the things they want in a distributor, or whatever you call yourself, and apply it to you. I do subtle little self-points like that. They can‟t object to anything that you‟ve said.

Participant:

Because it‟s not important.

Ross:

I know a student who used to get all sorts of jobs. He‟d go in and get jobs he wasn‟t qualified for. Ideal Candidate Pattern #2 128

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

He‟d say, “When you think about your ideal employee and you imagine all the things that you‟d like to find in this person, I‟m not sure just exactly how well you tune into that or how you know that you‟re tuning into that. “If you have any questions about what I‟ve done here, please, I want you to ask because that‟s part of our establishing the kind of communication that lets people know they want to work together.” He had people take a whole stack of resumes and throw them in the trash and say, “You‟re hired.” As you sit there today and think about what it is you want in your ideal teacher, I don‟t know just how deeply that can resonate with you in a way where you see an opportunity that you know you have to act on. But as that‟s happening, quickly, naturally and rapidly, I just want to let you know that I love spinning this shit off the top of my head. Do you see the structure of how it works? I‟ve gotten this down so I understand the formula. The formula is “As you think about what it is you want in your ideal X...” Of course, you‟re the ideal X. “As we‟re talking today, I just want to let you know that as you think about what it is you want in the ideal X and all the things you value in finding that X,” pointing to yourself, “there are ways you can recognize that you‟ve found your ideal X. “I don‟t know just exactly what those things are, but as we‟re talking today, if you have any questions at all about what it is that makes me that person, I just want to let you know, I have 129 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

no idea what those are. I think discovering those is part of the process of realizing you‟re making a good decision.” You can actually get them to look at you through all the things they value. Is that fair? Absolutely. Participant:

I like the way you‟re structuring it right now. Could you give us maybe two or three examples of a complete structure with no content, just purely structure, which we can write down and take home with us?

Ross:

Absolutely, I love that challenge. “As you sit there and you think about the morgle-borgle-orgle of the ideal orgle-smorgle-worgle that you would like to forgle-morgle-borgle, I‟m not sure just exactly what that is, but as you‟re discovering that, I just want to let you know that thinking about things in that way is part of the process of recognizing that you‟ve found the orgle-borgle-morble of your smorgle-worgle-porgle. I‟m putting in nonsense content to fill in the blanks.

Participant:

I couldn‟t write it down fast enough.

Ross:

You‟ll get the CDs. Ideal Candidate Pattern #3 It‟s, “As you think about or consider who you want for your ideal XXX, I don‟t know just how quickly those things can come to mind. But as that‟s happening, I just want to let you know that if you have any questions for me, please ask them. That‟s part of the process of recognizing that you are getting what it is you‟ve been looking for.” 130

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

That‟s another one. “That‟s part of the process of recognizing that you are getting what you‟ve been looking for.” Write that down, word for word. According to whom is that part of the process? Who says that‟s part of the process? But they‟ve bought into it because you‟ve been pacing everything else so far. It‟s also a truism because, frankly, that is part of the process. Think about this. Part of what gives this the skill is that on some level, even though I‟m being vague, it‟s actually an accurate pace for how people decide things. How do you decide that you want to work with someone? How do you decide that someone is worth hiring? On some level, you have to go inside and find the place in your mind where you think of what it is you want or value for that position and compare the person you‟re talking to against those values. Part of the reason it‟s powerful is that it is indeed an accurate description. Be specific enough to identify so they identify with it, but not so specific that they reject it. I said, “As you think about what it is you want in the ideal candidate…” I didn‟t say, “As you picture in your mind hiring a person who can run your IBM 361 computer…” I didn‟t say that. I‟m vague but specific enough where they get the general idea. As you sit there listening to me, you find your own reasons. That‟s another one I like. “Find your own reasons.” I use this in Speed Seduction® for my answering machine intruder. It‟s a guaranteed way to get a girl who hasn‟t called you back to call you back. 131 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I like to say, “You can find your own reasons.” What process do you have to engage in to find your own reasons? The most powerful persuasion matches the other person‟s internal experience on some level. How do you find your own reasons to do something? You have to have a dialogue with yourself, don‟t you? You have to go a little bit deeper into consciousness than the state that you were in when you first heard that statement. When you go inside and find what it is that truly motivates you, and you find how great it is to come from that level and look through that level whenever I‟m speaking to you, you can then recognize that growing receptiveness and utter receptivity to what it is I‟m saying. It‟s almost as if your own internal voice begins to say my words, as if my words were your internal voice. If I were to say, “Wow! That Ross is amazing,” can‟t you just hear that on the inside now? Did anyone find a slight little alteration of consciousness occurring as they listened to that? You can play with people with language. “It‟s not important” and “I don‟t know.” As you sit there listening to me, I don‟t know just exactly which of these fantastic learnings will excite you the most. Here‟s a pacing statement, “As you sit there, I don‟t know,” and then it‟s followed by the words “just exactly which,” “I don‟t know which”

or

“I

don‟t

know

just

exactly

which.”

There‟s

a

presupposition. The presupposition is that there‟s going to be something, but I just don‟t know exactly which.

132 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

What it is you‟re attempting to design? Participant:

An email blast to people to market a degree.

Ross:

“As you‟re reading this message and you begin to consider all the benefits and features you want in your ideal distance-learning program, I‟m not sure just exactly what they are. As they‟re coming up, follow along with me while I show you how fantastic this opportunity is.” You can pace somebody who is reading, too. “It‟s not important.” “I don‟t know.” “It doesn‟t matter.” Milton Erickson used that a lot. “It doesn‟t matter whether you go into trance here and now, or whether you find a trance developing nicely in its own time.” False Choices “It doesn‟t matter” is a great way to set up false choices. Have you ever hear the phrase, “Heads I win, tails you lose?” When I say, “It doesn‟t matter,” I know I‟m going to set up either-ors that don‟t exist in the real world. “As you sit there listening to me, it doesn‟t matter whether you find yourself totally fascinated by what I have to say, or you naturally and easily find yourself in a place where everything appears fascinating, or whether you just discover how good it feels to open your mind completely. What really matters is you discover for yourself which one of those feels most comfortable, natural and right for you.” You can see how I set up all those false choices. “It doesn‟t matter whether you find X, Y or Z,” where X, Y and Z are all the choices you want them to make. Those choices are how you want them to 133

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

think or feel about your proposal. In a sense, you‟re giving them three choices of what filter you want them to look at you through. They can look at you through the filter of utter fascination, wanting to believe or absolute gullibility. You set it up that it‟s going to be one or all of those. “It doesn‟t matter whether you find yourself totally fascinated about what I have to say, or whether you find yourself getting more excited about what I have to say, or more intrigued by what I have to say.” Participant:

Do you give those in patterns of three because three is a powerful anchoring number?

Ross:

I think so. It‟s like Mike Tyson used to throw combinations. He‟d only have to throw one punch, so that‟s not a good example. It‟s building cognitive momentum and emotional inertia: one, two, three, boom, boom, boom. One of my metaphors when I‟m spinning patter like that is boxing. I think to myself in combinations. It‟s kind of a hostile metaphor, but I like to think of it like that, like I‟m Ali at his prime. By the time they see it, they‟re already hitting the ground.

Participant:

Also by having three, you‟re giving lots of choices.

Ross:

If you give them just two, they‟ll think, “Wait a minute, that‟s an either-or.” If you give them three, it goes right in. “It‟s not important.” “I don‟t know.” “It doesn‟t matter.” They‟re very similar ambiguities. According to whom doesn‟t it matter? According to whom is it not important? What is it that I don‟t know?

134 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

It doesn‟t matter. If it doesn‟t matter, I don‟t need to worry about it. I won‟t resist it. If I don‟t know, then I don‟t have to resist the message because I‟ll think, “He‟s not claiming to be Mr. Know-ItAll.” They relax. They are softeners. They soften the person up. They drop their hands so in the match, you can go boom, boom. Think of them as body shots, to use a hostile metaphor like boxing. Do you ever watch some boxers? They go for the body before they go for the head. Why do they go for the body first? They drop their hands. If you hit someone in the body, their arms get sore. They drop their hands, and then you pop them in the head or in the face. These are softeners. “I don‟t know just exactly how quickly you can find yourself wanting to drop your panties, Debbie, or whether you‟ll find yourself just naturally and easily wanting to get into your birthday suit, or whether it just feels better to run around free as a bird, bookie-butt naked. But what is important…” That‟s a crazy example. Do you want more examples? Who has a business they want me to spin something on? Participant:

Selling ad copy.

Ross:

Are you selling your services as a copywriter? I don‟t know what you mean by ad copy.

Participant:

I‟m selling my services as a copywriter, as a freelancer approaching different direct marketers. Ideal Candidate Pattern #4 135

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

“When you think about what it is you want in your ideal copywriter and you allow those thoughts to come to mind as we‟re talking today, I‟m not sure exactly which ones will really grab your attention. “As you think about that, as we‟re talking together, I just want to let you know that the better questions you ask and the more thoroughly you ask me, the more you can recognize for yourself that, „Wow! This guy really matches that.‟”

Participant:

I have a question about the example you just gave. When you mention asking questions at the end, you‟re doing that because you know they‟re going ask questions and that reinforces what you just said?

Ross:

It‟s even cleverer than that because this is where it gets wicked-sick clever. This is the part I love teaching. This is wicked sick. “As we‟re sitting here talking,” which is a behavior, “and you think about this,” that‟s thought, “I don‟t know whether you‟ll think this, or think this, or think this.” There‟s behavior and thought, thought, thought. “I just want to let you know it‟s perfectly okay to ask questions,” back to behavior, “because that‟s how you can recognize that you‟re making a good decision.” They‟re going to come up with questions anyway. You‟re saying, “The fact that you have questions will cause me to conclude you‟re excited about this and I match what you‟re looking for.” You‟re hijacking the behavior of asking questions. In their mind, their unconscious says, “The reason I‟m asking questions isn‟t that I‟m screening him. The reason I‟m asking 136

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

questions is because I realize he matches all my criteria in the first place.” You‟re changing the unconscious meaning that‟s assigned to the act of asking the questions. No matter what they ask and what answers you give them, it reinforces the idea that you‟re the ideal guy. You‟re hijacking that behavior. We‟ll take a situation, and you know in this situation they‟re going to do a certain behavior. You go in beforehand and you pace as such that when they find themselves doing that behavior they say, “How did he know I was going to ask questions?” The unconscious says, “He told me that asking questions is part of the process of recognizing that he‟s the person I want. That‟s right.” They have two choices. Either they don‟t ask any questions and accept everything you say is true or they conclude unconsciously that any questions they do ask are only proof that they want to hire you. Do you see that twist you can stick into your mind? Then you put a spatial anchor around yourself. You say, “Picture the kind of person you really want for this job.” As you do this, you‟re drawing a picture around yourself. That doesn‟t work with everyone. Maybe 30% of the people will respond to it. Other people just don‟t visualize that way. They‟re not that suggestionable. For the 30% who do, this is what you‟ll see. I‟m exaggerating. Their pupils will dilate, you‟ll see them make the image, and they‟ll look at you through that. Your employee is rubbing a little bit of this on. As you tune in to how good that feels, I find that a lot of people can picture 137 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

themselves really enjoying it. There‟s a lot we‟re going to show you how to do. What city do you work out of? Participant:

Kansas and St. Louis.

Ross:

Are these chicks hot? They‟re hot Israeli girls, right?

Participant:

Of course.

Ross:

Maybe you need someone to come in and do an in-house training. I just said something in the Jewish language. You don‟t want to know. That‟s one of the first things I learned in Hebrew. We‟re speaking Hebrew. Never mind that. You don‟t even want to know! I‟m sorry. What were we just discussing?

Participant:

We just finished discussing how you set up the behavioral things.

Ross:

Isn‟t that wicked? “As we‟re talking today, think about what you really want in the ideal person for this position. Picture that in your mind. “I‟m not sure which of those thoughts will really grab hold. I just want to let you know that as that‟s happening, it‟s really important as part of this process that you feel free to ask any questions you want. That‟s part of the practice of recognizing you‟re really making the right decision.” Since you‟re referring to yourself with gestures, you don‟t say it‟s about hiring you. If you said, “It‟s part of the process of recognizing you‟re making a good decision about hiring me,” they would say, “Whoa! Hold on there, buddy.” You leave that part out.

138 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

This is really a way of hijacking the behaviors you know they‟re going to be doing anyway and changing the meaning of those behaviors. It‟s the equivalent of saying it, but you‟re not. You‟re implying it. “Asking questions about my qualifications causes you to conclude that I‟m the person you want to hire.” If you walked up to someone and said, “Asking questions about my company or qualifications causes you to conclude that I‟m the person you want to hire,” what would they tell you? I need verbal feedback. Participant:

You have a big ego.

Ross:

“Take a hike.” When you do it like this, it makes sense. They won‟t know it consciously, but unconsciously they‟ll think, “I‟m asking questions. He told me asking questions means he wants to hire me. Okay, I‟ll hire him.” That‟s wicked sick. You‟re enjoying this. You‟re holding your expression calmly, but you‟re really enjoying it. You‟re kind of the opposite of your dad. He wears his expression everywhere. You think, “No poker.” I can see from your eye movements that you want to scream out with joy, but you‟re clamping your mouth shut.

139 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 16 Operating System and Machine Language of Persuasion Participant:

When you do that, that‟s the sort of communication you were talking about the first day that manipulates how they reflect on the experience.

Ross:

I hate the word “manipulate,” but yes. It‟s conditioning their unconscious mind how to interpret when they pop out and wonder about what you‟re saying. That‟s exactly correct. It‟s part of that process of conditioning how they respond to their feelings about what you‟re doing and what conclusions they reach about it. This is the operating system and machine language of persuasion. The other tools you learn from other people are powerful to be sure. I encourage you to learn them. Imbedding commands, suggestions, and ambiguities is great. They‟re powerful strategies, but they‟re an application program like Microsoft Word or Safari. I‟m teaching you the operating system and machine language of how this works. It‟s a whole other order of magnitude and level of skill to see how this works.

Participant:

Could we get that last sentence you used? I know it‟s going to be on the tape, but I‟d like to get it and meditate on it tonight when it‟s fresh from the seminar. I‟d like the full sentence.

Ross:

Let me give you the structure of it. I‟m going to give you the formula. The first thing is you want to talk about a behavior that you know they‟re doing. Describe the behavior with an “as you” or “as we.” We go behavior, thought, behavior, conclusion about behavior. The

140 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

big level formula we‟re going to talk about is behavior as we talk together today. Then we‟re going to go to thought. “Think about what you really want in your ideal candidate.” Then you say what they‟re going to do with that thought. “As you think about what you want in your ideal candidate, I‟m not sure which of those thoughts will most powerfully come into your mind.” Now you‟ll give an accelerator. The accelerator is, “Those thoughts are going to really powerfully come to mind and grab a hold of you.” You want to use some accelerating language. Then you‟ll say, “As that happens, I just want to let you know that it‟s really important that you ask questions.” You‟re going to direct them to a behavior. We‟re fractionating here:

we‟re talking about behavior,

thought, behavior, thought. “As we‟re sitting here talking today and you‟re thinking about what you want in your ideal teacher, I‟m not sure exactly which of those thoughts will really grab a hold and come up strongly in your mind. I just wanted to let you know that it‟s really important that you find yourself asking questions. That‟s part of the process of recognizing you really want to learn from this person.” There‟s a behavior and then a thought. You‟re going to accelerate the thought by saying, “I‟m not sure which of those thoughts will most powerfully come to mind.” You could be even sneakier and say, “I‟m not sure which of those thoughts will powerfully come to mine.” Did I say “mine” or “mind”? Now you‟re giving them the suggestion to let your thoughts become 141 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

my thoughts. “Which of those thoughts will come to mine? Come to my thoughts.” Do you hear it? As that‟s happening, there‟s a good linkage phrase in there that lets you know you‟re making progress. “That‟s happening” is a suggestion. It‟s not a command. A command would be, “As you allow that to happen.” “As that‟s happening, I just want to let you know that it‟s really important that you ask questions.” There‟s the behavior. “It‟s really important that we have a dialog.” That‟s the behavior. Now you‟re going to tell them how to think about the fact that you‟re doing that behavior together. The next thing is you‟re directing them back to more thought. “I just want to let you know that it‟s really important that we have a dialog,” or “It‟s really important that you ask questions,” or “It‟s really important that you ask anything you want of me because I think that‟s part of the process of recognizing someone you can trust who you really want to work with.” Now you‟re going to tell them what conclusion they should reach and what meaning they should give to the fact that they‟re going to engage in this behavior. What does it mean to their mind? You‟re telling their mind what meaning, conclusion, or thoughts they should have about the fact that they‟re doing those behaviors with you. Do you get the formula? It‟s not word for word. “You know, Debbie, as we‟re spending time together this evening and really growing more comfortable and more drawn, I just want to 142 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

let you know that it‟s really important that you feel free to open up and ask me anything you want. I think that‟s part of the process of two people coming together in a way where you feel excited and can‟t even put your finger on the source of your excitement.” This is what I love to teach. I love to teach the hidden, underlying concepts. You talk about a behavior. “As we‟re talking today and you think about all the things you‟re really looking for in the ideal distributor.” Then here comes the accelerating language about thought, “I‟m not sure just which of those thoughts will most strongly grab hold of you and come to mind. I‟m not sure just which of those thoughts will really move, motivate, or inspire you. “I just want to let you know as that‟s happening,” there‟s the suggestion. Yes, that‟s happening. Those thoughts are coming up. “I just want to let you know that it‟s really important that we have an open dialog and you ask me anything you want. That's part of the process of recognizing this feels great and you want to continue.” Now you‟re going to tell them what conclusion they come to from asking all those questions or doing the behavior you described. “Doing this behavior means that I‟m someone you want to do business with, go to bed with, hire or whatever?” Now we‟re fractionating back and forth from behavior to thought to behavior to thought to conclusion about the behavior. It‟s sickly clever. Participant:

It‟s simple.

143 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

It‟s simple because you, as an inventor, understand procedures. You grasp this and you‟re excited about it. Da Vinci himself would love this. Once you understand the structure and what it‟s saying to do, you can go back to the little pieces of language like “as you” and “while you” and see how the little pieces, the imbedded commands and suggestions, fill it in. Other trainers will teach you the imbedded commands and suggestions, but they don‟t see the structure. I see that structure. You now have more understanding than the so-called best NLP teachers because they don‟t know this structure. They don‟t know where to look for it. Did anyone see the “Chronicles of Narnia” movies where they talk about the deep magic and the deeper magic? I‟m teaching you the deeper magic that underlies everything else. There‟s a level of seeing the matrix where you know how to use embedded commands and voice inflections. Then it‟s when you see this stuff.

Participant:

Can you define “accelerator” again?

Ross:

An accelerator is just telling them, “These thoughts are coming up.” Now you‟re going to tell them what the thoughts do. The thoughts take hold, motivate and excite them. Tell them how the thoughts affect them. This isn‟t what the thoughts mean. It‟s how the thoughts come up. “I‟m not sure just exactly which of those will take a hold or come up in your mind.” Under the guise of proclaiming ignorance, you‟re actually programming them completely all along the way. Isn‟t that clever? 144

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 17 Pseudo-Orientation in Time Ross:

I went through my archives and found some really cool stuff that I taught all the way back in 2006, but the people were going crazy and using it. I want to give you some pieces of languaging that are examples of some of the things I‟ve been teaching. You can insert them into your copy, if you write copy or do any kind of thing. This is something from when I was talking about pseudo-orienting people in time. When it comes to developing a nice altered state for your reader, listening, viewer, subject or victim—just kidding—I talk about orienting people in time, moving them around in their sense of time. You can have them imagine a time in the future having already done what you want them to do or already having bought and enjoyed your product, looking back on this moment of picking up the phone and ordering now as having been the start of that. Even listening to me say that bats you around. Listen to the distinction. “Pseudo-orient” means to take their present orientation of being in the present and move them so they feel that they‟re either in the past or the future. It‟s one thing to pseudo-orient someone so they imagine they‟re in the future. “Imagine a time in the future six months from now really enjoying this product.” That‟s good. You‟ve oriented them into the future. We all agree that that‟s useful. One way to go around resistance is to go to a place in time after the resistance has already been dropped. 145

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

If you can orient the person‟s mind to a place in time after the resistance has already been dropped, they‟ll no longer have the resistance. Move around their sense of time. In and of itself, it‟s not enough. If you use that in combination with other techniques, like creating a frame through which they view you with a desire to be convinced or a childlike state of mind, it becomes very powerful. I want to introduce a distinction to you. What kind of language would we use to orient a person to a future point in time? I want you to take notes. I want you to write down “pseudoorientation in time.” “Pseudo-orientation in time” is the method or technique of shifting your subject‟s perceived time focus. An example of pseudo-orientation in time is to have the person remember the past. Another example is to have them imagine being in the future. What are some pieces of language you can use to orient your client or subject into the future? Why would it be useful? At what point would you want to do that? Participant:

To look at the stock market.

Ross:

No. I don‟t mean literally going into the future. In their imagination, they‟re going into the future.

Participant:

To move beyond a resistance point.

Ross:

Rather than having to move through resistance, you can have them imagine a time after the resistance has already dropped.

146 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I don‟t want my clients or subjects to make a decision. I want them to imagine all of the fun and benefits after already having made the decision. I never want someone to make a decision. I want them to imagine all the fun, benefits and great stuff that flows to them after having already made the decision. A year ago, I had a dream. When I talk about dreams, I really have had them. I had a dream that there was a thick steel wall. I was on the other side of the wall, and a lot of people wanted to get through to me. They were trying to push through the wall and break through the wall. Then there was this kid. One moment he was here, and the next moment, it wasn‟t that he was on the other side of the wall with me but he was already 30 seconds into already having been on the other side of the wall. He didn‟t think, “I‟m going to go through the wall.” He imagined himself 30 seconds into already having been on the other side of the wall. There was no process of pushing through. He just imagined 30 seconds after he had already been on the other side of the wall. It was a metaphor for me that said there is an aspect of consciousness that can do that. You don‟t have to imagine people or imagine yourself pushing through a decision. I don‟t want people to push through a decision to get to what I want them to do. I want to orient them in such a way where they imagine not making the decision but all the good things they‟re having from already having made it at some point in the future‟s past. The future‟s past is still their future.

147 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Let‟s say it‟s six months after they‟ve ordered. I want them to imagine a time in the future six months from now already having enjoyed all the benefits and looking back on this moment of having made this decision as being the start of that. From the point of view of your future, this is the past. Participant:

Can you repeat the definition of “pseudo-orientation in time”?

Ross:

It‟s the process of shifting your client, subject, victim, reader or listener‟s perceived orientation or position in time. I like what your father, the inventor, said. “Let‟s move them to the future and read the stock market.” He‟s thinking literally. I love that, but that‟s not what I mean. I don‟t want someone to have to push through a decision or push through their decision-making process. A lot of persuasion techniques teach you to elicit their decision-making process and take them through that. I don‟t want to do that. I want to take them after they‟ve already enjoyed the benefits. Listen to what I‟m saying. I don‟t want to take them to after they‟ve made the decision, although that‟s good. Having them imagine already having made the decision is good. What‟s even better than that is taking them to six months past, enjoying it. The decision doesn‟t even come into it. They‟re just in a place where they‟re already enjoying all of the benefits that flow from having made the decision. Then they‟re really convinced because there‟s a lot of juice and positive stuff. You tie that in to what you know about their fears, failures, frustrations, hopes, dreams and desires. Then they really like it. 148

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

If I have them imagine a time in the future six months from now, really enjoying all the benefits of finally having victory in this area of life, as they‟re picturing that and really getting a feel for it, I say, “Wouldn‟t it feel great after you‟ve picked up the phone today to order this product? Then you can look back on this and think, „Wow, this is the most fantastic thing I‟ve ever done for myself.‟ Now, before that happens, let‟s take a moment now to look at this.” Here‟s my point. Pseudo-orientation is very useful because it enables them to go after after having made the decision. It enables them to go after having made the decision, but also it enables them to go after after having made the decision. After after having made the decision means they‟re really imagining all of the benefits. Now making the decision doesn‟t even enter into it. Have you ever bought a car and really enjoyed driving it for six months or a year? You no longer think about how you made the decision. That‟s way in the past. An hour after you‟ve bought the car and are driving it home, you may think, “Why did I do that?” or, “How did I do this?” I don‟t want them an hour after. That‟s good. It presupposes that they‟ve already made the decision. But if you can orient them six months from then, that really makes the decision nothing. You don‟t have to worry about it. Subjectively, it means, “All the benefits of having it so far outweigh buying it that I have to do it.” The imagery in their mind of enjoying it becomes so big and compelling that the imagery they were making of hesitating just shrinks down to nothing If they try to get it back, something just gets in the way. 149 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Are you beginning to see how this ties together? This is my job on the third day of teaching. On the third day, I‟ll rise again. Have you ever seen these ads for Cialis? “If you experience an erection lasting more than four hours,” call all your friends! How is that for having you picture a benefit? “We‟re warning you how well this can work. “If you experience an erection lasting more than four hours,” call all your ex-girlfriends and get on the internet. That would really hurt, wouldn‟t it? An erection lasting more than four hours is calling dating a 20-year-old Swedish girl. I love my job. This is where it gets really fun, where I tie things together. Now you begin to see how the concepts work together. Pseudo-orientation in time can include orienting them into the future or confusing their time sense. Let me give you an example of the wording. I‟m going to read it out loud to you word for word. I don‟t want you to take notes. You can finish writing that last point. Then I want you to put your notes down, and we will parse through it. This is from a presentation I gave in 2006. “Before I finish speaking to you today and you find yourself imagining what it would be like six months from now, really having enjoyed all the benefits and looking back on this moment we shared as having been the start of it, I‟m not sure exactly what comes to your mind, but I‟m glad I had the opportunity to speak with you today. Now, before I get into that, let me talk to you about this now.” How many different orientations have I given you? 150 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Four.

Ross:

“Before I finish speaking to you today.” That‟s one and two. “And you find yourself imagining what it would be like six months from now.” That‟s three. “Looking back on this moment as having been the start of it.” That‟s four. “I‟m not sure exactly what comes to your mind, but I‟m glad I had the opportunity to speak to you today.” That‟s five. “Now, before we get into that.” That‟s six. “Let me talk to you about this now.” That‟s seven. “Before,” “now,” “yesterday,” “today,” “after,” “when.” When you do that, the conscious mind gives up trying to follow. The conscious mind can‟t track it. It‟s a useful confusion. There‟s a useful confusion and a non-useful confusion. A non-useful confusion is that kind of confusion we talked about over there this morning. Useful confusion is the art of artful confusion. Let‟s talk about the art of artful confusion. Confusion is basically useful because it overloads the conscious mind‟s ability to follow. Sometimes when you address people, you want to fractionate back and forth between allowing their conscious mind to follow and confusing their conscious mind‟s ability to follow. When you create conscious overload, the conscious mind stops trying to follow, and the unconscious mind comes up, but you don‟t want to confuse them so much that they become uncomfortable, shut off completely, and try to escape. Overload and confusion is a way of inducing trance. Our friends over here understand that well. Right, Mike? 151

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

Absolutely.

Ross:

In fact, you can overload someone by giving them too many things to pay attention to. It‟s a classic. “Do this while you blink your eye.” Boom, they go out. You can confuse by orienting them in time across past, present, future, now, then, and whatever. Another way to confuse is where people can‟t quite tell who you‟re referring to. This is called scope ambiguity. Scope ambiguity has to do with them not knowing who you‟re talking about. I like to use something I call the I/you shift. This is really useful. I‟ll start talking about my experience, and suddenly, I‟ll shift to you. I want you to write down “scope ambiguity.” Overall, I want you to think about this, how confusion can be useful. You can write down, “The art of artful confusion.” As I said to you, Mike, the other day, when I teach, I come up with things on the spot that I can then turn into products and elaborate on more. This is an example. I never thought of the art of artful confusion before just now. I‟ve thought of these concepts but not under that umbrella. Mike has been studying with me since ‟97. He keeps coming back for more, as does his friend. You can confuse people by moving them around through time, pseudo-orientation in time. When I teach you a tool or concept, I want you to understand what it‟s aimed at doing. Why would it be useful to confuse people in this way that I‟m talking about? It overloads the conscious mind‟s ability 152

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

to keep track. When the conscious mind can‟t keep track of what‟s happening, the unconscious mind opens up. Knowing how to skillfully keep track of when you‟re inducing confusion and when you‟re inducing clarity is really useful. Remember, I talked about fractionation. This is another way to fractionate, between confusion and clarity. When you confuse then move back to clarity, wow, people really want the clarity. Are you confused or are you clear? Or are you finding that each or both can suddenly switch so the part that was confused now becomes clear and the part that was clear now becomes confused? Confused? Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

There‟s what you know, there‟s what you don‟t know, and there‟s what you don‟t know you know. When what you don‟t know you know becomes what you know, then you can think of things differently. You know?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

After you‟ve understood that, right prior to your concluding that before you take action on it it‟s something you need to clearly understand today, let me say this now. You can‟t keep track consciously, can you? It‟s pseudo-orientation in time but also scope ambiguity. “Scope ambiguity” means the person can‟t tell who‟s being referred to. Are you referring to them? Are you referring to yourself? Are you referring to people in general, which is what we call in English the 153

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“editorial you”? My mother first taught me that idea. Are you referring to one specific person other than yourself or them? Those are the categories of scope ambiguity. Let me give you an example. “Speaking to you as someone who really loves to learn, I find that when I focus in and really allow those thoughts to run through your mind, that‟s when I can really realize, wow, you‟re really learning something special.” Did you hear that? “Speaking to you as someone who really loves to learn.” Does that mean I‟m someone who loves to learn and am speaking to you? Does it mean, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn,” meaning I love to learn and you love to learn? Does it mean both of those things or neither? “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, I find when I focus in and really listen carefully, and I let those thoughts run through your mind.” Now I just shifted from “I” to “you.” I do this with women. I say, “I find when I really focus in and pay attention to those thoughts, and I allow myself to let yourself go.” That‟s another example. Do you hear it? “I just allow myself to let yourself go.” “I find as I pay attention and allow those thoughts to run through your mind.” I‟m shifting from “I” to “you.” I call it the I/you shift. You can call it the I/your shift. Do you see how that works? Participant:

You go back and forth.

154 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

We‟re going to take turns drilling with this.

Participant:

You also have phonetic ambiguity.

Ross:

Am I saying “your mind,” “you‟re mine” or both? Phonetic ambiguity is something else. Right now, we‟re doing scope ambiguity. “Speaking to you as someone who really loves adventure,” “Talking to you as someone who really loves to learn,” or, “Speaking to you as someone who‟s really invested in learning.” What does that mean? Does it mean me? Does it mean you? Does it mean both of us? “Speaking to you as someone who‟s really invested in learning, I find when I really focus in,” by the way, that‟s a way of embedding commands, “and listen carefully, and let those thoughts run through your mind.” I let those thoughts run through your mind? What? “That‟s how I can come to the conclusion that this is something that I really want to let yourself do.”

Professor:

Someone could hear the last statement you made and believe that you‟re being incoherent.

Ross:

That‟s even better. If they‟re invested in understanding the message because I‟ve done all this other stuff, and they think, “Wait a minute He‟s being a little bit incoherent,” they will attempt to resolve the conflict on my side of the fence. That‟s a good point. If it is part of a chain of communication where they really believe that I‟m an expert and are looking at me through a frame of awe, and they think the message is awesome, then you‟re right. They‟ll 155

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

think, “He‟s being incoherent,” but they‟ll resolve it in my favor. “I may just not understand what he‟s saying. I need to pay closer attention.” Have you ever had that happen? Professor:

Yes.

Ross:

Good catch. Thank you for that contribution. Here‟s the structure of it. The structure starts with “speaking to you,” “addressing you,” or “talking to you.” I‟ll do this in a sales letter. I‟ll say, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to invest in their future.” Does that mean me or them? In the English language, it can mean both or either. “Speaking to you as someone who loves to invest, I find when I focus in on the opportunities and imagine really winning, I can conclude that this is an exciting opportunity you want to take.” You‟re enjoying this. The light is going on for him. You have a very intense look. You don‟t smile. Why is that? You don‟t visibly smile. Hey, dude, I have cats. I‟ve gotten into a staring contest with my cats and won, usually. Say, “Speaking to you,” “addressing you,” or, “talking to you as someone who X,” where X is the positive quality you want them to assign to themselves or way of thinking that you want them to live up to or identify with. You don‟t say, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to ignore opportunity and fail through life.” This is really good when you do sales because when you say, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn,” they think, “Yes, 156

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I love to learn,” and, “Yes, this is a learning.” It‟s also part of convincing them what the meaning of the transaction is, not that you‟re selling them, but that they love to learn. “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, the story of how this fantastic investment came to be is an interesting one that I enjoy sharing with people who really love to do something good for themselves. Before I do that, let me just tell you a little bit about who I am.” If you want people to invest, use scope ambiguity to get them to buy into the idea that it‟s a learning. If you just said, “I think you‟re going to get really excited about what you‟ll learn today from me about investing,” that‟s not bad. It‟s good. You can say, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn about what enriches you in this life, I find that when let yourself really think about that…” In writing, it doesn‟t work as well. It‟s harder because people can spot the ambiguity. When you speak, it works really well. You can still use scope ambiguity when you write by saying, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, the story of how this opportunity came to be is an interesting one I‟d like to share,” which presupposes that it‟s learning and a story. If all you do with your sales letters is include that bit of language, your response is going to go way up. “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, the story of how this opportunity came to be is an interesting one that I can‟t wait to share. Before I do that, let me tell you a little bit about how I discovered this.”

157 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Do you get that little piece? Put in your sales letter, “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn.” Wait a minute. Speaking? You‟re not speaking. I‟m reading it. There is all sorts of confusion. Ross:

“Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, the story of how this opportunity came to be is one I‟d love to share. Before I do that, let me tell you a little bit about how I discovered it.” What are the presuppositions? It‟s a story, you‟re going to share it, and it‟s a discovery. First, you‟re sharing a learning. You‟re giving them an image to live up to. As soon as they live up to the image, “someone who loves to learn,” the presupposition is that what they‟re about to do is learn. “Speaking to you as someone who loves to be over,” assumes that they love to be over. The ambiguity of not knowing who‟s being spoken to sets them up to accept the premise that indeed they‟re going to be learning. Once they accept the premise that they‟re going to be learning, they view it not as a sale but as a learning. If you talk about, “the story of how I discovered this is an interesting one I‟d like to share,” those are the shared activity verbs, “discover” and “share.” “Explore with me for a minute.” Do you get how it stacks on? Here‟s what wouldn‟t work. “I think you‟re someone who loves to learn, so let me share with you the story of how this came about.” What do you mean I love to learn? How do you know? You‟re trying to trick me into living up to the image of someone who loves to learn so you can do that NLP shit on me, right?

158 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 18 Scope Ambiguity and RJ‟s Metaphors When you use scope ambiguity, they say, “Is he saying that he loves to learn or I love to learn? I‟m not sure, so I‟d better listen. I don‟t want him to think that I don‟t want to learn,” even if you‟re not there. Scope ambiguity allows you to slide in the presupposition that this is a learning, not a sale. If you don‟t do scope ambiguity, they‟ll say, “Don‟t try that on me.” “Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, the story of how this opportunity came to be is one I‟d love to share, but first, I want to tell you how I discovered it. My name is Jack J. Jackoff, and not so long ago…” Scope ambiguity enables you to slide in whatever frame or meaning you want to give to the transaction. That‟s part of the power of it. It can involve not knowing who you‟re addressing. What were the other aspects of scope ambiguity I gave you? One is that they don‟t know who is being addressed, them, you or some other person. Then I gave you the I/you shift. You can‟t use the I/you shift very well in writing, but you can use it speaking. You can say, “I find that when I allow that way of thinking to run through your mind, I really let those images empower me to make a decision you really want to make.” Do I mean the editorial you, meaning me, you or people in general? You could say, “I find when I allow those thoughts to really take hold in your mind,” or, “I find when I really allow X to run through 159 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

your mind, it‟s the kind of thing that can allow a person...” What person? “It‟s the kind of thing that can allow a person to come to the conclusion that, wow, this is really amazing.” What is that little piece, “Wow, this is really amazing”? I‟m throwing my words into their head. As they‟re reading that, they‟re going to think, “Wow, this really is amazing.” If I say to you, “It‟s the kind of thing that can allow a person,” who is that? Which person? Then I said, “To come to the conclusion that, wow, this is really amazing.” That‟s the tricky part. That‟s not saying, “Wow, this is amazing.” That‟s putting those words into your mind right now. When I said that, did you find yourself thinking, “Wow, this is really amazing,” a millisecond after I said it? Participant:

It seemed like everything else was so confusing, but that part was clear.

Ross:

Of course! That‟s just it. Now you‟re getting it. Everything up until that moment was confusing, but then I gave them something specific to think. If it‟s unclear and then you tell their mind to think, “Wow, this is really amazing,” suddenly you‟ve filled in the blank, and that‟s exactly what they‟ll think. This is what I call „mental ventriloquism‟. Throw your words into their mind so their mind speaks the words. That only works because you‟re using scope ambiguity, in terms of who you‟re addressing, and the I/you shift. Then you‟re giving them the specific thought to have. If you started with the specific thought, it wouldn‟t work. 160

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Remember that when you‟re doing persuasion, some things have to be done in sequence. There‟s the excellence or skill of doing things in the right sequence. You‟ve got to lead it in the right order. Then there are some things that you do recursively, meaning sometimes you‟ll return to them. Periodically, I‟ll return to being clear. Then I‟ll return to being confusing. Periodically, I‟ll return to being vague or change the scope. Am I clearly referring to myself or them, or is it not clear who I‟m referring to? When it comes to excellence, there are things you have to do sequentially. You have to do them in a certain order. There are some things I do recursively. I return to them periodically. There are some things I do all the time and never stop doing. When it comes to persuasion in person, I‟m always observing the other person, calibrating them, in rapport, and controlling my state. There are some things you do before the persuasion, which are how I prepare myself and study what I know about the other person. Preparation excellence would be rehearsing my state and doing whatever research I need in order to know about the other person. If I know I‟m going to seduce a woman, I can get on her Facebook profile or read her blog. I can pick out her trance words and feed them back. I can prepare myself. There is preparation excellence and consistency excellence, which you do all the time. You never stop doing it throughout the persuasion. 161 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

There is sequential excellence, which you do in a certain sequence or order. For example, “Wow, this is really amazing,” has to be done in the right sequence. There is what you return to recursively and periodically. You go back to things. Periodically, I will be vague or specific. Participant:

In confusion, your mind wants to grab hold of something that makes sense. At the same time, you‟re fractionating.

Ross:

Then there are the things I do afterward, my review excellence. How do I get in the right witness consciousness to review what I did, select out what worked really well, emphasize that, and see what needs correction? Getting back to scope ambiguity, you can do the I/you shift. The I/you shift enables you, finally, to put in a specific thought, like, “Wow, this is really amazing.” You can say, “As you imagine a time six months from now, already having really enjoyed everything you want from X, won‟t it be great when you can look back on this moment of having made the decision as being a part of this?”

Participant:

I gave that to my salesmen to use with store owners. They told them to visualize themselves being successful in the future.

Ross:

Did it work?

Participant:

I just gave it to them. I imagine it will.

Ross:

The I/you shift is another part of scope ambiguity, and it sets up putting in a specific thought, like, “Then you can just think, „Wow, this is really amazing.‟” 162

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Do you see how this stuff is beginning to tie together now? Part of how I teach is to give you scattered little things and build response potential, so the last day when I tie it all together, you‟ll think, “Wow!” You‟ll notice that the felt sense of understanding feels different kinesthetically than not being sure. The felt sense is how you can convince yourself, “Oh my god! He is an amazing teacher!” Do you notice how that helps you become even more confident that you‟re going to use these tools? I think the process of recognizing how great I am as a teacher only allows you to feel more convinced and confident that you‟re going to use these skills. See how that works? Personal Trance Words Participant:

You mentioned being able to extract somebody‟s trance words out of their writings. How do you identify the trance words?

Ross:

Remember what I said. There are trance words for everyone, like “wonder,” “ponder” and “imagine,” but there are personal trance words. Do you remember what mine were?

Participant:

Expand.

Participant:

Possibility.

Participant:

Creativity.

Ross:

How can you tell these in writing? You can tell if they‟re writing about something they‟re passionate about or “my passions.” If they say “horseback riding,” that‟s not a trance word, but they may say, 163

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“Wandering down the trail as I ride my horse and being in touch with the awesomeness of nature.” “Awesomeness” and “wandering” are nonspecific words. They don‟t really describe something that you can put in a box. If they‟re writing about their passions, chances are that you have a trance word. I dated an artist. This was great. I looked up her art website. There were certain words she said. “I love the moment of creating something larger than life that opens up new opportunities, connecting in the moment, and living now.” I knew they were “larger than life,” “opportunities,” “connecting in the moment,” and “living now.” I just fed those back to her, and she said, “Wow, I‟ve never had anybody who understands me this well. Can we go back to your car?” Boom! I had done my homework. Ross Jefffries‟ Metaphors Sometimes I use the image of Batman. There‟s a reason why Batman could win. He had no super powers, but Batman would study his opponent, so before he even fought them, he knew all their weaknesses. He knew all his points of leverage. Sometimes I visualize Batman. That‟s my sign to prepare in advance, study up, and know everything I need to know about that person. What is one of my metaphors? If I talk about Batman as someone who organizes my consciousness, what is one of my overall areas of life where I draw metaphors from? Participant:

Superheroes. 164

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I‟m wearing a Green Lantern ring! If you wanted to influence me, you would make a list of all the words that are associated with superheroes. What are some of the words or ideas you think of when you think of superheroes?

Participant:

Transformation.

Participant:

Flying.

Participant:

Nobility.

Participant:

Kryptonite.

Ross:

Good one.

Participant:

Crime fighter.

Ross:

My metaphors are aviation, comic books and felines or cats. I love aviation. Granted that you know that, there is a set of imagery and words which are likely to have an influence on me. Remember, I talked about finding out what people‟s personal metaphors are. You know the old sales thing. You go to make a sales call, and you see someone has a trophy, a fish on the wall. They teach you to talk about the fish on the wall. Yes and no. What you want to know are the metaphors that are common to fishing. What are the kinds of phrases we use when we refer to fishing?

Participant:

Catch.

Participant:

Bait.

Participant:

Lure. 165

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Reel them in. Hook them.

Participant:

Got a big one.

Ross:

“I‟ve got a big one here for you. Let me bait the hook a little bit.” Just take the metaphors that are common. You could say, “What do you really enjoy about fishing?” Listen to what words they lean on. They may say, “I really like the peacefulness and tranquility.” There‟s what you say, knowing how to elicit other people to talk about the areas that are going to give you useful responses, and noticing how to notice their responses that are useful. Then there‟s knowing how to incorporate those responses. Let me back up. There‟s knowing what states you want to be in when you‟re persuading and getting into those states, there‟s knowing what to say, there‟s knowing what to ask that elicits the right information or responses, there‟s knowing how to notice those and what to pay attention to, and there‟s knowing how to utilize those responses and feed them back in a useful way. Responses can be useful, like what they say, but they can also be nonverbal. Did you see my nonverbal responses when I said “expand” and “creativity”? You not only want to feed back “expand” and “creativity.” You want to feed this back. In fact, if you feed this back but talk about what you want, you don‟t even have to say “expand” and “creativity.” I will attach it to that. The skill sets of persuasion are knowing how to get yourself in the proper state, knowing what to say, knowing how to get the other person talking in a useful direction, asking the questions or bringing 166

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

up the subjects that will get them talking, knowing what to recognize and look for, recognizing what to look for and listen to, and finally knowing how to feed back or incorporate what you notice in a useful way. The responses can be verbal, nonverbal or both. In my case, that‟s a really good one, isn‟t it? How would you incorporate the nonverbal part into communicating with me in a persuasive way? You‟d say, “Let me give you an idea.” I‟m going to go up here and look at your idea through that. Now you‟ve got my ass. It doesn‟t work on me because I‟m aware of it. Would this be useful in personal, face-to-face selling? Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

Are you paying attention to any of this, Yoav? I‟m giving you guys a lot of answers before I bring you up here. Scott, you‟re excited about this, aren‟t you?

Yohav:

Can you give more specific examples?

Ross:

More specific examples I will do when I bring you up here. Are you excited about this?

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

This is really cool, isn‟t it?

Participant:

Can you go through those five again?

Ross:

How to prepare or control your state. This is very important. This is something I do all the time. 167

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Types of Excellence Let‟s back up a second to complete a loop. When it comes to excellence, there are some things you do the preparation period for. There is preparation excellence. There is sequential excellence, what you do in the right order or sequence. Remember, I said an example was scope ambiguity. Scope ambiguity is one tool to set up the frame or meaning that what you‟re doing is a learning. The transaction is a learning, not a sale. After you use sufficient amounts of scope ambiguity confusion by using the I/you shift, then and only then, you give that specific thought, “Wow, I want to do this.” There‟s sequential excellence, things you do in sequence, just like when you bake a cake. When you bake a cake, you don‟t mix in all the ingredients, shove it in the oven for 45 minutes, then when you take it out, crack in the eggs. Sequential excellence is very important. Where most people limit themselves is being totally focused only on sequential excellence. The way in which they code things is only looking at how things progress through time. They want to know what they can do with the excellence as they and their people progress in through time. They‟re not even aware of these other categories. There‟s consistency excellence. Those are things that you‟re going to be excellent at throughout, and you‟re never going to stop. It takes place throughout the entire transaction. For me, that means 168 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

being in control of my state, and if I‟m in front of a person, being in rapport. There‟s periodic or recursive excellence, what I return to from time to time and what I fractionate along and back and forth between. Then there‟s review excellence. What do I do to review what I did so I extract maximum information, continue with excellence, and add in or subtract or otherwise correct what needs to be corrected? What was the loop I opened before that? Participant:

The five skill sets.

Ross:

The first skill set is being able to be in the right state. Do you want to be in the noisy, confused, desperate state?

Participant:

No.

Ross:

1) Being in the right state, 2) knowing what to say, 3) knowing how to get the other person talking, 4) ask the right questions, and 5) bring up the right things that get them to give you useful responses. Useful responses can be verbal and/or nonverbal, just as I showed you. Among the useful responses can be personal trance words, nonverbal responses and personal anchors. There‟s knowing what to say, knowing how to get the other person responding in the right way, and knowing how to notice those responses. You have to know what to look for. Then there‟s knowing how to incorporate and utilize those responses. 169

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Each one of these is a skill set that you may naturally already have. You may naturally already have one or more of these. Good. Keep improving those. But then see where you see to fill in the blanks. Where most people get into trouble with persuasion is that they think it‟s just about what to say when in fact that‟s one-fifth or onethird of it. Most courses in persuasion will either teach you only what to say or will teach you the other things partially or ineffectively. One of the most dangerous things you can do in learning is to find half-truths. Have you ever heard this one, you create your own reality? Maybe, but if someone drops a bomb on a city and kills millions of children, those children didn‟t create that reality. That‟s a huge, sick distortion. I‟m overloading you with stuff because I want to give you as much as possible. What I may do is for each of these is to create an online module that I charge you a nominal fee to access. You‟re all getting the four weeks of support for free, but I may then create these modules. What I may do is experiment with you. You participate in these modules for free in exchange for helping me develop them, which I then turn around and sell to the general public.

170 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Chapter 19 Summary, Hypnotic Trance, and Conclusion When we started out Friday night, I said that when your prospect, reader or listener comes to you, they don‟t come with a blank slate. The learning I gave you was that people‟s emotions can be usefully viewed as something that not only takes place in the body but is projected outward as a lens or filter through which people see their world. Bear in mind the understanding I gave you this morning about how people dwell on mistakes. They ruminate and program them back in. Now you see how that fits in with the first learning I gave you Friday night. One of your jobs as a persuader is to be aware of that and use these various tools to create the right kind of filter, and equally important, to create the meaning that people give to the transaction. It‟s not that they‟re being pressured or sold. They‟re taking part in a valuable activity that‟s being shared, led by someone whom they can trust who they perceive as an authority in their world. I gave you different techniques to establish that authority or their perception of that authority. Do you remember what they were? Participant:

Pacing.

Participant:

Borrowing their anchors.

Participant:

Artful vagueness.

Ross:

Being artfully vague was the number one thing I told you about.

171 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

“Speaking to you as someone who loves to learn, I‟m not sure just exactly which of these tools excites you the most, but as that‟s happening, I think that when you stop and imagine a time in the future, say six months from now, looking back on all the things you‟ll enjoy, you can recognize that that process of enthusiasm is one of the ways in which you can recognize that this is something really interesting.” That‟s vague language. You have no idea what I said, but it matches your experience somehow. Then I told you that a really excellent persuader not only moves emotions and sets filters, but they manage people‟s investment in that process so when they look at it, they think, “This feels good. This feels right. I want to keep doing it.” I drew that distinction. I said that when you persuade, there are certain skill sets. They‟re not necessarily in any order. 1. Making sure you‟re in the right state. 2. Knowing what to say. 3. Being able to get the other person talking in the right way. 4. Knowing what to recognize. 5. Utilizing it. I also talked about excellence. I said that there are different stages of excellence. There is preparation excellence, what you do before it happens to get prepared. 172 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

The second is sequential excellence, how you‟re excellent in things that go in a certain order. There are certain things that you only want to do in a certain order. Then I talked about consistency excellence, those things you always want to do. When I persuade, I always want to be in the right state, and I always want to be in rapport with the other person. Then I talked about the really tricky one, the one that‟s absolutely the key to mastery. What was it? Participant:

Recursive excellence.

Ross:

Those things that you periodically go back to. Finally, there‟s review excellence, what you do when the whole thing is done to review what you did so you can extract maximum learning. This ties in to witness consciousness because through developing that witness consciousness, you can extract out the lesson because you‟re no longer tied in to old patterns. Remember what I said. Old patterns of responding do two things. They distort our perception and drive our behavior. Just by virtue of the fact that your perception is no longer distorted and your behavior is no longer driven, you‟re at a huge advantage over everyone else who is mostly running those programs. Each of the smaller tools that I‟ve shown you are ways to make those things down-to-the-ground reality. Now do you see how it all ties together?

Participant:

Yes.

173 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Friday and Saturday, I was giving you little pieces that didn‟t tie together. Today, I tied them together. What was my purpose for only giving you little pieces but not really showing you how it fit together, other than that I like to irritate you?

Participant:

Creates response potential.

Ross:

This is part of what you need to do as persuaders. If you shove it all down someone‟s throat, they‟re not going to want it. By building potential every step of the way, people want more. The model that persuading or seducing is about forcing things on people that they don‟t want never worked, doesn‟t work and is stupid. Define “persuasion” not as getting people to do what they don‟t want to do but showing them how to enjoy the process of getting what they want. Here‟s the really cool one where you really contribute to the world. It‟s expanding their sense of possibility so they suddenly realize there‟s something they want that they didn‟t even know consciously they wanted before or that they want even more than they did a moment ago. That‟s what is possible. That‟s the set of possibilities you can have. Hypnotic Trance You‟re developing a trance very nicely there, Brock. You‟re sitting there, completely cataleptic, and your hands are stuck to your lap. You‟re looking at me. That‟s a nice trance of attention that you‟ve developed. The thing about trance is this. You can listen to every word I say and pay attention, and you don‟t have to. You can send your mind 174

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

far away and ignore everything I‟m saying, and you don‟t have to. You can listen to every word I say and send your mind far away. You can send your mind far away, and you can listen to every word I‟m saying. In trance, things that normally don‟t go together can go together and come together. In trance, those things that normally go together can be separated out. It‟s not a function of how deeply the trance goes but rather how useful the trance is. Remember, I talked to you about the building blocks of ordinary day reality. As you‟re sitting there, in your own way, you can begin to remember what it was like when you were a child and learned to tell time. How did you first learn to tell time? Looking at the clock or looking at the watch? There was a moment just before you finally understood what it meant. I remember looking at a watch very carefully. I couldn‟t understand how the hand pointing to the six meant 30. Why wasn‟t it 12:6 instead of 12:30? There was a moment when your mind opened and suddenly you understood what before was unclear. Once your mind opens and you look through that understanding and desire for more, you can never go back to not understanding. Think about it in just that way, in the same way that you learned to tell time. Once you learned to tell time, you didn‟t know that learning to read a clock or read your watch would become the foundation of so many things. It would become the foundation of how you would meet a friend for coffee, when you had to show up for a job, or how you would keep track of how long you had done a certain task. 175 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

None of these things ever occurred to you when you were an infant. These are the building blocks of reality, the things we take for granted that run in the background of our everyday life. When you wake up in the morning, how long does it take for your sense of “I” to wake up with you? How long does it take for that program that says, “Here I am in my world,” to boot up when you wake up in the morning? The notion that you have a self is something that was enculturated and programmed into you. There are other notions that are part of your reality that were put into your mind. They were sold to you. We talked about measuring the length of things. Remember, I talked about, “Do you remember the first time you learned to measure things, the first time you learned how to use a ruler?” It took a while to understand the concept of inches. Inches don‟t exist in the world. I can‟t say, “Go bring me a bucket of inches.” It‟s a human idea. Yet the ability to measure things is also part of how we communicate and move through the world. It‟s our sense of time and our sense of reality. When you measure something, that‟s when it becomes real. It‟s part of our convincer in reality strategy. What if you were to just take a deep breath and imagine a future where all of your desires were already being fulfilled? Inside, you could build some way to measure it in a way that made it just as real as measuring out 6 inches of cloth or a yard of thread. That desire would seem much more real because you were assigning a measurement to it.

176 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

On a scale of 1 to 10, I don‟t know just how clear that can become, and it doesn‟t need to become clear. Remember, I also talked about other things that gave us our sense of reality. I said that once you make these discoveries, your mind can never go back to the way it was. I invite you to take a deep breath. You don‟t need to close your eyes because you can stay in trance with your eyes open or closed, it doesn‟t matter. If you were to imagine a time in the future, say six months from now, already having enjoyed six months of all the benefits that flow to you from using these skills, I‟m not sure just how excited you can be to really go out and apply them, but as you take another deep breath and look right up here, you can see that understanding and opening your mind to every word I say is your key to making it work. Isn‟t that an interesting thing to think about just that way? Conclusion I want to thank you for being with me for the last three days. We will schedule the four follow-up calls. I think we‟ll schedule the first one for the third week in July. I need a couple of weeks to work out some other things. For those of you who have books for me to autograph, you‟re crazy, but I will autograph them. Thank you for attending and being part of the experiment. Thank you to Lisa who made it all possible. Thank you to my operations guy and webmaster, Adam Hommey. I am my cat‟s father. Thank you very much. 177 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Workshops

178 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Workshop Candidate: Darren Ross:

We‟re here with our first workshop attendee, Darren Williams. Darren, give me a brief description of what you‟re doing and where you would like to improve. Tell me what you do.

Darren:

I hike in Yosemite National Park and just take pictures of what I see.

Ross:

I‟ve seen the pictures. They‟re quite beautiful.

Darren:

Thank you. I‟ve hiked over 1,600 miles up there.

Ross:

How did you get into hiking? Can you remember the first time you did it and what the experience was?

Darren:

Absolutely. I‟m a nurse by trade. I picked up a digital camera and started taking pictures of the Golden Gate Bridge because I was in the Bay Area.

Ross:

Had you done any photography before?

Darren:

Absolutely none.

Ross:

Do you remember what the impulse was? I want to get his story because often what sells is the story of the person who‟s doing the thing. Do you remember where you were when you got the thought to grab a camera? What inspired you to pick up the camera?

Darren:

I had always wanted a digital camera. One of the local stores had it on sale, and it included a memory card, so I said, “Okay. I‟ll go get it.”

Ross:

Did you have any idea of what you wanted to do with it? 179

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Darren:

I just wanted to take pictures. I had no idea. I was in the Bay Area, so I started taking pictures around San Francisco and fell in love with the Golden Gate Bridge. The people at work were encouraging.

Ross:

Stop. Let‟s get to the emotion of that. What do you mean you fell in love with the Golden Gate Bridge? That‟s a metaphor, by the way. You‟re not bringing it flowers and humping the girders. Maybe you are. I don‟t know. This is San Francisco we‟re talking about.

Darren:

No, that would put too much iron in my diet. I loved all the different angles to take the photos and the different times of the day and evening.

Ross:

Let‟s slow you down. How does the character of the bridge change according to the light and time of day? Tell me a little bit more about that.

Darren:

In the morning, it‟s not as bright. It has a lot of fog and everything around it, so it‟s mysterious and inviting.

Ross:

In the beginning of the morning, the bridge is like a what?

Darren:

It‟s like a mistress. As the day progresses, the orange of the bridge becomes more pronounced and magnified. The light reflects all of that and makes it much more pronounced. As the sun crosses the sky and goes to setting, I noticed at different angles that it would really offset. Some evenings, there would be pinks, oranges and purples. It would really stand out a whole lot more.

Ross:

Now tell me about hiking on the trails. How did that happen?

180 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Darren:

After everybody got sick and tired of looking at the different pictures of the Golden Gate Bridge, they said, “Why don‟t you take pictures of something else?” Being a redneck and not from around the area, I said, “What else is there?”

Ross:

Stop. That‟s a good one. Everyone, write down “a redneck.” Whenever he uses something that people can identify with and that‟s metaphorical, my ears go up. A redneck calls to mind a certain image. It‟s specific enough to identify, but not so specific that people can‟t fill in their own details. That‟s the first metaphor he came up with on his own. I had to elicit the metaphor, “It‟s like a mistress.” How are you a redneck?

Darren:

I‟m from Georgia.

Ross:

I know people from Georgia who are not necessarily rednecks. Do you live any kind of redneck lifestyle?

Darren:

No. I live up in the mountains in a nice house. One of the ladies really liked Yosemite National Park, so she started telling me about it. I didn‟t Google it or anything. I just got MapQuest directions and went there. Since I work on nightshift, I left at 3:00 in the morning and got there before the sun rose.

Ross:

Let‟s skip that part. You fell in love with Yosemite. How many pictures have you taken of Yosemite?

Darren:

I‟ve taken in excess of 75,000.

181 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s a lot of encounters with Yogi Bear. That‟s Yellowstone, right? Have you seen wildlife there?

Darren:

Absolutely.

Ross:

Do you have pictures of wildlife?

Darren:

Yes, I do.

Ross:

How close have you gotten?

Darren:

I‟ve been this close to a bear.

Ross:

That‟s pee-in-your-pants distance. What was your mindset when you got that close to a bear? Were you scared?

Darren:

Yes. The first time, I was hiking along. I had been up for about 18 to 20 hours. I had hiked about 20 to 22 miles that day. I was going along and moving as fast as I could to get to where I wanted to be for sunset. Bears in the summertime smell like an outhouse.

Ross:

That‟s because they shit in the woods, right?

Darren:

That‟s exactly right, and I have video of that, too.

Ross:

I have a word for you: YouTube.

Darren:

I looked up, and there was a bear not too far from me. It was just ripping apart a tree stump.

Ross:

Oh, for kicks it rips apart trees.

Darren:

It was eating grubs and bugs. I followed it for quite a while. All of a sudden, it stopped, turned around and looked at me. It came straight at me. 182

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

It didn‟t attack you?

Darren:

Not at that time. I looked around at everything, and then I realized that I heard some clicking sounds. I looked up, and about 10 or 15 feet away from where I was standing were a couple of bear cubs going up a tree. I was too close to its babies, so I picked up my tripod and just started running. I ran through the Manzanita bushes.

Ross:

It didn‟t come after you?

Darren:

No.

Ross:

That‟s enough of those stories. What would you like to do with this business? What is your goal?

Darren:

It‟s aWaterfall.com and iWaterfall.com.

Ross:

Those are domain names. That‟s all they are. What are you looking to do?

Darren:

I want to use iWaterfall.com to put out some video and background screens and market them to the iPhone people.

Ross:

Are you looking to sell an iPhone app?

Darren:

Exactly.

Ross:

I don‟t know this business. The first question we have to ask is whether there is money here. If there‟s not money here, then what you have is a hobby, not a business. Let‟s slow down a minute. Scott knows this business. Scott, you‟re my co-instructor for this. Is there money to be made in iPhone apps?

Scott:

Yes. It‟s not guaranteed, but done right, it can work. 183

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Done right, how does that revenue model work? How do you make money off iPhone apps?

Scott:

There are plenty of different ways. One that I might recommend to you is to sell a basic app. Then you can sell add-on packages to that application.

Ross:

What is the procedure by which you sell an app? Do you create it and get it in their App Store?

Scott:

Yes. There‟s a $100 fee, I think, to have them look at it. Then they put it in the App Store.

Ross:

How does the revenue share work? If he sold the app for $1 a download, what piece would he get, and what piece would they get?

Scott:

He gets 70 cents on the dollar.

Ross:

There we go. When you say that you want to sell an app, let me be clear about something. You‟re correct, but there‟s another sense in which that answer is incomplete. It‟s not a wrong answer. It‟s an incomplete answer, meaning that people don‟t buy the app. They buy the experience that the app allows them to have or create. For example, I have a couple of apps. I have Truphone, which is fantastic. If you have an internet connection and a wireless connection, Truphone will make a call over your wireless through your internet so you can do internet calls on your cell phone. It‟s really good and cheap. You buy preloaded time, and it‟s really cool. My girlfriend uses my phone to talk to people in Sweden very cheaply. Otherwise, she just wouldn‟t call her family. 184

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

What does Truphone do? It gives you cell phone access over the internet. You get cell phone convenience at internet prices. You need to be able to sum up in a word or two what it does. I also have Uno because I love playing Uno. I get to play Uno and practice so I can beat people. When my girlfriend and her friends play, I kick their asses because I play a lot of games on here. Yes, you‟re selling an app. I got that, but my question is, “What is having the app going to allow the people to experience that they otherwise wouldn‟t?” Here‟s how you design a product. The product is going to be more convenient or have a lot of really super-cool features, like the iPhone, or the experience of using it is going to be really fun. You can give them convenience or enjoyment of the experience of using it. It can do something really cheaply or combine the features of two different things that normally wouldn‟t work in combination to do all those things. The product might be super expensive, the luxury version, like the Rolls-Royce or Maserati. There‟s a company in Sweden that bought out Saab. They make cars that do 240 miles per hour. They‟re not selling safety. It‟s $1 million a car. You can sell high-end luxury, which you‟re obviously not selling in an app. You can sell connectivity, the ability to connect to other people and have that experience. It‟s the ability to create a tribe. Essentially, what are you doing? Are you going to be selling screensavers?

185 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Darren:

They are videos of the waterfalls that I‟ve taken.

Ross:

I understand that, but what is that letting people experience?

Darren:

It‟s letting them experience all the coolness of being there. It‟s exactly like being there.

Ross:

That‟s not bad. “The coolness of being there” is a start. The name that you give the app is a big part of whether it sells and the way in which people search for it. I‟ve never done this. This is interesting.

Participant:

Wouldn‟t he be selling the ability for people to change their state of mind? If they‟re in a busy business day, they can experience his application and have a moment of calmness.

Ross:

You‟re selling waterfalls. My first thought is that it‟s too specific. I could be wrong. Why not waterfalls in Hawaii, Singapore or Saudi Arabia? You could have WorldwideWaterfalls.com. Are you willing to modify what you do? By the way, this is confidential. He uses it, not you guys. Why not have Worldwide Waterfalls? This is just an idea. I don‟t give about Yosemite, but Worldwide Waterfalls has a lot more appeal. Could he create an app, Scott, where people submit their waterfalls from around the world?

Scott:

He certainly could. The question is why create an app versus a website?

Ross:

Essentially, what you have is a lot of video of pretty stuff.

Darren:

It‟s a glorified hobby. 186

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Not necessarily. Just hold on a minute. I‟m not willing to go there just yet. We have a lot of powerful, creative minds here, and that‟s part of why we‟re coming together. Do you think people would pay to download video of waterfalls on their iPhone?

Scott:

There are a certain number of people who will buy anything that you can sell on the iPhone. I think there‟s a very low barrier to entry in terms of putting up videos of waterfalls online, on YouTube for free. Is it a higher quality video or better sound? What do you get from watching it via the phone or a site that you put up that you don‟t get from watching it on YouTube?

Ross:

Let me challenge your rigidity. If you‟re this good a videographer and nature photographer, have you thought about getting a printed book of beautiful, high-end photography instead of doing it on the internet? Ansel Adams made a hell of a lot of money. I‟m just giving you a different idea.

Darren:

I‟ve thought about it a little bit.

Ross:

What‟s your objection to that?

Darren:

Absolutely none.

Ross:

I don‟t think this is an internet thing at all. I‟m being blunt with you. I don‟t think people are going to be willing to download or look at it. That doesn‟t mean that there aren‟t vehicles for the talent. What I am claiming here is that there is a vehicle which you can joyously use to produce a really nice living for yourself. That‟s what 187

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I‟m going to claim right here and co-claim with you. Let‟s co-claim that and take a start on that. Participant:

He can do postcards and calendars.

A.J.:

I don‟t know how well it would do as an iPhone app, but you could still do it as a hobby and get into the blogging world. You could take that route, and then people would come to see your site. As far as making money, you could do it how a lot of bloggers do it, by doing the whole ads thing. That‟s one route. As far as waterfalls, I think there are probably thousands of sites that already do worldwide waterfalls or something like that. You have to be really competitive as far as marketing it. Talk to somebody like Scott as far as that goes.

Ross:

Here‟s another thought. If you can‟t make your business the primary business, you can make your business an addition to or add-on to a primary business. How many companies are making tons of money selling stuff that goes with the iPod? They didn‟t come up with the iPod, but they‟re making a lot of money. This is what they call an enabler. Your business, product or service enables the experience the people get from their primary business, product or service. You might want to think, “How can I be a highend enabling business for experiences that people have?” Here‟s just one idea. If you could find people who do Outward Bound or nature journeys, you could partner with them to offer a video package where you go out as part of it and do really beautiful, high-quality

nature

photography

of

the

surroundings. 188 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

people

in

those

There‟s a guy named Paul Lemberg. He has something called Formula 5 where he talks about the elements of product creation. Paul is the expert on that. He‟s a www.StomperNet.com faculty member, but he also has Formula 5 that he sells separately. As a Stomper member, I get it free. I would look up Paul Lemberg if you‟re looking to do product creation. Rather than thinking of your business as a primary thing, you can also consider it an add-on to something that other people are already doing. If you have people who are doing Outward Bound stuff, nature journeys or safaris, you could show them examples of your work and say, “Have a pro videographer do your safari for you. I‟ll come with you and give you documentary-quality footage.” You‟re used to being outdoors. Are you a good outdoorsman? Darren:

Absolutely.

Ross:

They don‟t need to pamper you. You‟ll go right out on the trail with them. Do you have skills as a nature guide?

Darren:

I‟ve never tried, but I‟ve taken several people out.

Ross:

What if you teamed up with someone who‟s a good nature guide and took people out? They‟d do that part, and you‟d do the photography. Or you could team up with the company and include it as an add-on package. That‟s just one idea.

Participant:

He could make mouse pads and screensavers.

Ross:

Mouse pads and screensavers don‟t monetize particularly well.

Participant:

I know a guy living at the lake who has a pretty nice house he made from just making mouse pads. 189

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

What kind? What did he cater to? How long ago did he start doing it?

Participant:

It must be seven years now.

Ross:

With mouse pads, you have to get distribution. I‟m not saying you can‟t do it as a side piece of income, but I don‟t think it‟s something where you can make a lot of money. I could be wrong. For that matter, you could make cups and toilet paper, but then you‟re in the manufacturing business or hiring people to manufacture. I don‟t know if that‟s something you want to do, but my intuitive sense says no.

Participant:

What if you use your website to send a newsletter or some sort of update every week or month to promote your documentary style of videography? At the same time, you could partner with the tourist locations to promote it in some way.

Ross:

I smell money here. In fact, you could create nature documentaries. You could go out on their safari, nature journey or Outward Bound and say, “Be the star of your own nature documentary with _____.” Make them the star of their own nature documentary or safari. You would be out there documenting it. You‟re not a filmmaker. You‟re a documentarian. I‟m feeling my way through this.

Participant:

Maybe there‟s a way to combine all that with the current global warming and green thinking. Perhaps like what you were just saying about putting people in a documentary, you could put how people are contributing.

Ross:

No, that doesn‟t resonate with me, but thank you for the idea. 190

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

“Discover the splendors of Yosemite that the average person never experiences.” Worldwide Waterfalls is too big. You need to niche. A niche is Yosemite. You‟ve traveled 1,200 miles in Yosemite, so you need to start making little YouTube videos. Get Twitter and Facebook accounts, and hook them all up. That‟s the deadly trifecta. Once you‟ve done that, you need to sell people little maps and stuff on how to experience the parts of Yosemite that they‟ve never been to. Where are those people? Where are your customers? They‟re in Yosemite. They get a million people a year.

Ross:

Mike, slow down. Notice the speed at which the person you‟re speaking to processes and speaks. I‟m not saying anything about the content of your idea. I‟m talking about the manner in which you deliver it. Slow down. Use your own skills.

Mike:

I‟m excited for him!

Ross:

I‟m glad you‟re excited, but listen to me. This is a point, everyone. Enthusiasm can destroy a presentation and sale if it‟s not done in the right amount or at the right time. If you‟re selling face to face, enthusiasm at the wrong time can destroy a sale, contrary to popular belief. Open yourself to a perception. I‟m saying this as a teacher with compassion and accuracy. Your ability to have your ideas well received will skyrocket when you learn to ground into your feet, slow down and speak from your feet rather than your head. Speak slowly and with less intensity and volume so people can receive it. I‟m just telling you that, but go ahead. I like your enthusiasm. 191

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

Cadence is important. I don‟t disagree with you, but the reason I spoke fast is because I didn‟t want to take up a lot of the time and I have a lot of ideas to give. If you‟d rather have me talk like this, I have no issues. You can give people the tours and experiences that they‟ve never had before. That‟s something you should consider doing because that‟s really where you are. You‟re an expert on Yosemite.

Ross:

The challenge I have with that is that it limits your market. If your skill is a fantastic nature photographer, aim high. Aim at the people with a lot of disposable income. I don‟t think those are necessarily people who choose to vacation in Yosemite. My idea, and this is just an idea, is to sell your skill to produce documentary-quality footage of your journey into nature worldwide, wherever you find yourself. Position it as something that‟s a highend, luxury kind of thing. You can partner with people who do those kinds of Outward Bound journeys and add it on. I don‟t know how you‟d monetize it, how much you‟d need to charge, and how much they would be willing to pay to do it. It‟s just an idea. Yosemite is a good idea, but how much money and how many people are you going to have to do to build a revenue stream? How much money are the people who go to Yosemite going to be willing to pay for that? It‟s my perception. I don‟t know because I‟m Jewish and my idea of “back to nature” is a Winnebago with a black-and-white TV.

192 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Darren:

One of the thoughts that I had was to get some billboard space or purchase some property along the different routes into Yosemite and put some of my pictures up. They could be huge pictures with signs saying, “Didn‟t get the pictures you wanted? aWaterfall.com.”

Ross:

If you‟re going to create a business model, you have to ask, “How does it monetize?” Where are you going to be collecting the revenue? How much can you charge? Where is your profit margin?

Mike:

Have you inherited a lot of money?

Darren:

No.

Mike:

A documentary costs $50,000 to $100,000 to shoot. It‟s a great idea, but you have to take baby steps first.

Ross:

I didn‟t mean literally a documentary. I said documentary-quality footage.

Mike:

You want to get people to know, like and trust you. By putting out these little videos and doing all this stuff step by step, people are getting to know, like and trust you. Then you‟ll have an entry-level sale. You‟re going to have to move them up and up. Eventually, you can do all those things that you were talking about, but you need an entry point.

Ross:

Based on your personality, as someone who‟s taught people for 20 years, and on what I feel, here‟s what I would recommend you do. Find someone who‟s a really good salesperson, a go-getter who likes doing this. Make them your birddog, the person who goes out and finds businesses who already have the customers. I disagree with his strategy of you trying to find the customers.

193 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

There‟s a concept in marketing called NEER, naturally existing economic

relationships,

or

PEER,

pre-existing

economic

relationships. This is just an example. If you had some little retail item, rather than opening up your own store, try to get Wal-Mart to carry it. We‟re talking about a service here, but I‟m saying you could find a way to partner with companies who already do Outward Bound journeys or something very high-end. If you get Robb Report, look in the back. They have ads for exotic vacations, like flying a MiG in Russia. If you could find those companies in the back of that magazine that do luxury safaris and nature things, you could pair up with them. Given that your skill is as a photographer and not as a salesperson, my suggestion is that you find someone who can do that, be your middleman and do the negotiations, and give them a piece. That‟s the way to do it. Scott:

What is it that you really like? Is it Yosemite or taking pictures?

Darren:

Yosemite.

Scott:

National Geographic runs a travel service where they have one of the photographers who take pictures for their magazine teach the people who go on these luxury, high-end travel tours how to take the best kind of pictures they could possibly take with their digital SLRs.

Ross:

That‟s brilliant! I‟m so happy. Why don‟t you create an online course that they can take? You can run a contest. Have people submit their photos, and you say, “I‟m going to take three people and teach 194

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

them how to be master nature photographers for when they go on their journey.” Even create a kit for dads. “Okay, Mom. Dad takes crappy videos? Here‟s how to train him in three downloadable lessons.” You‟re a genius, man! Fire every other client. You‟re working for me. Scott, expand on that. Scott:

One, you‟re looking for people with disposable incomes, people who buy $1,000 digital cameras. They have disposable income and time to go on these treks to Yosemite. You have the expertise both in Yosemite and digital photography to teach or tutor them. It could be in online packages. It could be on a week-long luxury trip where they stay in the nicest lodges in Yosemite. It could be whatever.

Ross:

In that way, your existing photographs aren‟t what you‟re selling. The existing photographs are proof of your skill that other people would like to copy. “Take professional-quality photographs of your journey with _____.” I don‟t know what the slogan would be yet.

Scott:

National Geographic has that undisputable proof that they have fantastic photographers who are going to teach you. Your existing body of work is that proof. The next point is unrelated. It goes back to the original question you had. I want to tell everyone about this tool. It‟s called Google Insights for Search. It‟s a keyword research tool that tells you by time and by year.

195 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

How do you find it? What is the URL?

Scott:

Search Google for “Google Insights.”

Ross:

What does Google Insights do?

Scott:

You type in a top-level keyword, like “waterfalls.” It comes up with related queries and queries that are newly popular. It tells you where in the world it‟s popular and how that keyword volume is trending over time. When I‟m doing research for a possible business idea, that‟s the first place I always go. I check out what existing search volume is there for it. For you, I‟d say that “Yosemite photography” may be a good keyword for you to start with.

Ross:

Let‟s try it. Let‟s see what search results come out for “Yosemite.” I like this idea. Scott, would you sell an online course or something to teach people how to do it?

Scott:

The online course could be a great way to do lead generation. Maybe you could even put up YouTube videos for free on Yosemite photography tips, but I think your high-value, high-dollar item is going to be the tours you give in Yosemite, teaching people where the beautiful pictures are that you have.

Ross:

Give them photography tours that show them the best places to go. Also, teach them the skills to take their own photography. You can position yourself as a master photography teacher. I like this. I really like this.

196 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

Getting back to your original idea which was about an iPhone application, one element that didn‟t seem to be emphasized was the audio aspect of the thing. Assuming that your passion is for this iPhone application, we need to bring the audio into it and figure out how we would market that aspect. Just as a possibility, what do people do on their iPhones? They listen to music and so forth. These things provide a means of escape. As opposed to high-techno music, some people might be interested in something meditational, even mystical. One of the possible avenues is how the sounds of Yosemite can bring some soothing to somebody stuck in L.A. traffic, for example. That‟s just a thought, how to bring the audio aspect and not only the visual aspect into your idea for an iPhone application.

Ross:

I think he‟s right in the sense that it might give it a higher perceived value. It might monetize fractionally better, but I don‟t think an iPhone app in this area is really going to be the answer. If the app itself taught them how to take better photographs, then that might have some value.

Participant:

It could teach them how to take better pictures with the iPhone camera even.

Ross:

That‟s really good. That would not be a Yosemite application, though.

Mezra:

Ross has brought up an important point. What‟s the experience you are going to offer them? I believe the biggest selling point would be that all of us are in buildings. We see chairs, cars and so much

197 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

cement and metal. It is, on a subconscious level, very stressful for us. All of us crave to get in touch with nature. Getting back to the iPhone application idea, if it could be a screensaver on my iPhone, then I would see the video of the live waterfall. Darren:

It‟s not just a regular waterfall. Of course, it has a rainbow in it.

Mezra:

If I could see the rainbow and waterfall, and if I could hear the waterfall, maybe I could have the added feature of putting people on hold and they‟d hear the same waterfall. When I take pictures, I could put the waterfall in the background of the picture and send it to people. As I play my pictures in the picture section, I could still have the waterfall as the background. There may be several other ways of adding the waterfall concept to other things that I will do. Maybe I‟ll take a video, and the waterfall will be the background. You would open it up for everybody else to download waterfall pictures from all over the world. You‟d scan it and make sure it‟s good quality. Then you would put it up there. It‟s purely waterfalls, and you would have a cool name like “Tranquil Falls” or “Tranquility.”

Ross:

Thank you. I like the idea, especially that when you put someone on hold, it pops up. I just don‟t know about the app thing.

Scott:

You can get a basic app made for a few thousand dollars. It‟s low risk if you just do basic pictures.

198 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

We could try it. The question is: Is there a way to popularize the app through social media? Scott, let‟s say we were going to design a social media strategy for him to popularize the app. What would the social media strategy be overall, in broad brushstrokes? Would you create an expert or enthusiast blog to drive traffic? How would you use social media to call attention to the app? Scott, give a definition of social media.

Scott:

Social media is things like Facebook and Twitter. It‟s stuff that is spread virally from people to people. It could be from a business to a bunch of people as well, but more often it‟s among friends and peers. First, you have to think about what the niche is. Is it specifically Yosemite, or is it more generally waterfalls?

Darren:

It‟s specifically Yosemite.

Scott:

I would take a look at the search queries that are out there. Is there a niche or query that‟s being used right now that‟s unfulfilled? That‟s built-in traffic which is looking for something you have that there is no answer for right now.

Ross:

In fact, that may work to his advantage because it would be a longtail keyword, “Yosemite waterfall pictures” rather than “Yosemite” or “Yosemite pictures.” It would be a long-tail keyword with a lot of words that are very specific. He could niche it more easily that way.

Scott:

“Waterfalls” generally probably has a lot of competition. “Yosemite” generally probably has a lot of answers and competition. I honestly have no idea.

199 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I would give away a few pictures first. As long as you watermark them whenever they get spread around, your domain, Twitter handle, Facebook page or whatever can be imprinted on those pictures. Ross:

There‟s an application called Twitpic. Do you know what Twitpic is?

Scott:

Yes, but he would want to put up high-quality pictures that become people‟s desktop backgrounds. Every day that they‟re looking at that picture, they‟re also looking at the URL, Twitter handle or whatever. You need to figure out what the goal is of spreading all these free materials around. You need to ask people to do something. Giving away free stuff is great, but what is the goal of giving away that free stuff? Is it to download the application for $1?

Ross:

Is it to capture an email address and sign up for a newsletter?

Scott:

I think a great way to do it is a “waterfall of the day” email newsletter, or “waterfall of the week.” I think there are a lot of people out there who like that soothing aspect of the waterfall. If you send it to them once a week, they could replace their background every week.

Ross:

Thank you, Scott. Let me take this from a different perspective. One of the things I‟ve learned about business is what you‟re not going to do. Make a “do not do” list. What are those aspects of doing this that you just don‟t want to do and are not willing to do? Would you be willing, for example, to create some kind of online course that teaches people how to do nature photography?

200 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Darren:

Absolutely.

Ross:

“How to” sells. How‟s this: “The City Slicker‟s Guide to BreathTaking Nature Photography,” or something like that? “The Urban Dweller‟s Guide to _____. I need a metaphor. I‟ll come up with it, but I like the idea of teaching. Are you willing to open a gallery, to be an artist?

Darren:

Yes. I have some friends who have done that.

Ross:

Ladies and gentlemen, we have the search results. What did we search for?

Participant:

“Yosemite waterfalls” and “TheWorldofWaterfalls.com.”

Ross:

Wow! “Waterfalls of Yosemite” and “The Waterfalls of Yosemite Valley.” I‟m going to show these to you. Here‟s what you‟ve got. You

have

“Waterfalls

of

Yosemite,”

“Yosemite

Waterfalls,”

“Yosemite Waterfalls—South Yosemite,” “Yosemite National Park Wikipedia.” Let‟s go to this site. One way to do it is to see what other people are doing. What is “Waterfalls of Yosemite” promoting? It‟s a Berkeley educational site. It‟s just displaying them. It‟s nothing for sale. Scott:

You can see that the keyword I‟ve typed in here is “Yosemite Falls.” There is search volume here represented by this graph. You can see that it‟s actually a seasonal trend. This is looking over the last four years. There are peaks during summer months, not surprisingly.

Ross:

How much traffic is there? 201

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Scott:

If you‟re logged in, you can actually see how much traffic this keyword gets as compared to other keywords. It doesn‟t give you exact impressions per month.

Ross:

The next time we do this, we need to get a projector that projects from a Mac so that people can see this.

Scott:

Down further, the next bunch of information we get is a map. In this case, we‟re looking all over the world. I‟m going to click on the US, and it‟s going to show me only data from the United States now. It‟s going to update all the other areas, so you can see, not surprisingly, that California is the number-one area for this. This is where it gets really interesting. Down here, it shows you related queries, and it will show you new queries or queries that are increasing in search volume over the past couple of months.

Ross:

Can we tell if there‟s any commercial activity based on these searches? This just tells us that people are looking. Can we tell if these queries result in people buying anything? Can we tell that from Google, or is there another tool we need?

Scott:

There is a tool. Microsoft adCenter Labs has a tool called Commercial Intent. It‟s a meter, an index.

Ross:

There‟s a program called Market Samurai that has all this. Market Samurai will not only show you search traffic, but it will also show you what articles are being published on the internet related to that and what blogs talk about that search item. It will also show you the Microsoft commercial index. It will show you which searches are resulting in people actually buying. Those are the terms you want to use. 202

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Scott:

The simple test is to just do a Google search and see if any ads appear on those queries. If ads appear, someone is monetizing that keyword somehow.

Ross:

That‟s a traffic issue. The issue here, and we keep coming back to this, is: What are the skill sets that you can sell? You can sell the photographs, but if you do that, I don‟t like the idea. Go ahead and do the app because it won‟t cost you anything, but don‟t rely on that. You need to go really high end and sell a really high-end, slick book. I don‟t know how exactly you‟re going to do that, but that‟s one avenue. The other avenue is teaching the skill set in some form. I‟m not sure exactly what form that teaching would be, either an online course or a DVD/CD that they buy that shows them how to take professionalquality, breathtaking photographs. Teach them how to do that through some kind of online course. You can niche it at first. Make it first about Yosemite, but then spread it out. A lot of people would like to photograph like a professional on an amateur‟s budget. “Here‟s how to squeeze the most out of this piece of equipment and this piece of equipment. Here are the hints. Here‟s where to go to photograph it. Here are my secrets ______.” Now my mind is turning on. I think what you really need to sell is the skill set that you have. Use the photographs as proof that you‟re good at doing it. Don‟t limit it to waterfalls, but make it any kind of nature photography.

203 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Darren:

I have a very high-end, wide-angle lens. Then I have a cheapie $50 Best Buy wide-angle lens. To compare the two, the difference is so small that you‟re paying $500-plus for about this much more of a strip.

Ross:

“Why pay $500-plus for a professional-quality lens when you can use my three amazing secrets to squeeze professional-quality photos from a $50 lens? Dear friend who wants to shoot like a nature photographer but spend like a bum…” or something like that. Create a course that shows people how to copy your skill set with very cheap equipment. Now I‟m on the track of it. Now my metaphor mind can turn on.

Participant:

If that‟s the kind of thing you‟re going to do, one really good way to find your market is to go to a big bookstore and check out the magazine racks for travel magazines. See which ads repeat by people who are in the business that you‟re going to be in. I guarantee that someone is selling something similar. If you can get a hold of them and get their lists, or just see what‟s repeating so you know what to sell, that‟s a good way to find your market. If you start with your product, you don‟t know if it‟s going to sell or not, but if you get in the way of a market that‟s already doing really well, it‟s shooting fish in a barrel.

Ross:

Now we‟ve zeroed in. Have you ever seen this guy, Video Professor? He sells CDs on how to do things. I think you should create some kind of online course. Can somebody get online and go

to

GoDaddy

to

see

if

NaturePhotographyTips.com?

204 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

someone

has

By the way, if you wanted to take photographs in other places, this is a deductible business expense. How horrible if you fly to Alaska to take glacier pictures. It‟s a legitimate expense. Participant:

NaturePhotographyTips.com is taken. We‟re looking at a few others. Give us a few minutes, and we‟ll get back to you.

Ross:

I‟ll grab those domains for him, and then I‟ll give it to him as a gift if you find anything similar.

Lisa:

I was looking up WorldofWaterfalls.com as a website. They have one specifically for Yosemite, and they have a picture photo gallery and free screensavers. They also have it where you can do travel and a lot of things we were saying. I was wondering if you wanted to check with them and say to them, “You have some pictures. I have some I think are unique. You are in the area that I already want to get into, which is Yosemite. I am an expert. This is what I can hand you.” They‟re a huge site with waterfalls from all around the world, but you have specifically Yosemite. You may have some angles or the one with the rainbow which is unique.

Ross:

With respect, Lisa, how does that monetize or create a business model? That‟s a thing to do.

Lisa:

You sound like you still want something to do with Yosemite specifically. I was trying to salvage that part. This also has travel and guides. He was talking about a partner you could do something with.

205 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

You could approach them and find out where in Yosemite they need somebody with your expertise and skill. They‟re a large company. That means they already have that set up. They have the contacts. If you wanted to get started in a small way, you could say, “I have all these photographs. I know the park like the back of my hand.” You have some unique photographs from there. They already have the market and website. You say, “This is what I can bring to you which you may not already have.” Ross:

Where‟s the money in that? How much money are they going to pay him for more photographs to put up on their website? It doesn‟t monetize.

Lisa:

They also have travel and a huge number of things they offer. I was just thinking that if he wanted to get started in there, since he likes Yosemite, he could come to them with his expertise and say, “How can I fit in?” You were talking about partnering.

Ross:

That‟s an idea.

Participant:

In my previous, not my current, position in the same career, I managed a resort in Alaska for Princess Cruises. The gift shops are one of the highest per-foot revenue streams for the cruise industry. You want to stay in Yosemite. Ross is talking about process. You have to ask yourself, “Do you want to sell a process, or do you want to sell a product?”

Ross:

That‟s a brilliant distinction. Thank you.

206 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

I‟m not sure that you want to mutually exclude either. To sell the process, you have to first establish yourself as the authority, as we learned all of yesterday and this morning. One way to do that might be to look at what is available. I‟ve never been in Yosemite myself in the park. Most national parks do have the historic hotels. There are certainly a lot of tour operators. Look where the money is. You need to see where there are people with big pocketbooks who don‟t have those skills, and whether they want those skills or they want the product of your skills.

Ross:

I think that‟s an absolutely brilliant distinction. Here‟s what I have tried to say: Look where the money is. Look where people have a lot of disposable income. Otherwise, you‟re going to be spending a ton of money to sell one photograph. It‟s not worth it. I don‟t care where you sell it to. Where are people spending money for this kind of thing? My first hit, as I said at the very top of this, is that people are spending a lot of money on nature tours. That‟s what I would investigate. Part of buying into this is that you get four weeks of follow-up support. I think we‟ll do the first follow-up support call in two or three weeks. I need time to rest and do some other things. We‟ll keep you well-informed. You‟re all invited to join in on that call. I‟m only going to be working with the workshop people, but everyone can listen in. Your first assignment is to do research into companies that offer high-end adventure tours and travel tours to nature. I‟m trying to tell

207 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

you that if you limit it to Yosemite, you‟re limiting your income vastly. I believe we‟re in a depression. Not me personally, but the economy is in a depression, not a recession. In depression, highlevel luxury items don‟t suffer because there are always going to be people with a lot of money willing to spend it. Those are the people you want to aim at. The first question is: What is the process that we can develop whereby he can do that research and find those people? The second question is: Once you‟ve researched and found those people, how do you go about, or find someone who can go about, offering your services? Maybe you have the skills to sell it, and maybe you don‟t. I don‟t know. You need to make a strategic decision at that point and ask what the smartest strategy is. “Do I want to approach these people and offer my services, or do I want to hire someone to do it?” My recommendation is that you hire someone to do it. If you make the decision to hire someone to do it, you have to ask, “What is my procedure to find someone who I can hire to do it?” I want you to think in terms of process and procedure. The big thing that Rich Schefren at www.StrategicProfits.com changed for me is to think in terms of procedure. If anything ever happens to one of my independent contractors, I can say, “Here‟s their process. Follow their work process.” I can remove myself progressively from my business because I have well-described processes.

208 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I want you to think in terms of process. What is the process you can use to research where people are spending a lot of money on nature and adventure tours? The second thing is that you need to make a decision. Are you going to be the one to sell your services, or are you going to have someone represent you? If it‟s the second one, you need to say, “What is the process whereby I find someone who can do this and hire the right person?” You need to work that out, and you also need to work out your revenue model. What are the various packages I can charge? Generally speaking, there are three different levels, like silver, gold and platinum. That‟s the kind of thing you need to do. You need to have a conversation with yourself. Personally, I‟m just telling you. I don‟t care what other people have said. Take their advice into account. If I were to say to you, “What‟s the number-one constraint on your idea?” in my opinion, the number-one constraint is that you‟re only willing to go to Yosemite. The big money doesn‟t go to Yosemite. The big money goes to Kenya, Nepal or the Alps. Maybe some big money goes. If you‟re a really rich German, maybe coming to Yosemite happens. Lisa:

For the names in GoDaddy, NaturePhotographySecrets.com is available.

Ross:

Grab it!

Participant:

NaturePhotographyClass and NaturePhotographyWebinar available. 209

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

are

Ross:

Grab those three on GoDaddy, and then we‟ll transfer ownership to Darren.

Darren:

Thank you.

Ross:

Do you understand the processes that I said you need to work through? Your biggest constraint is that you‟re limiting it to just Yosemite. Look. You‟re skilled more broadly. It‟s not just photographing Yosemite. You have great skill as a photographer. If you‟re willing to stretch yourself and go outside that boundary, you can make a lot of money. That concludes yours, but you have four weeks of follow-up support. Your first assignment before we do the first phone call is to find out the process of how you can research how and where people are spending money on nature tours and adventures. Thanks.

210 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Workshop Candidate: Yoav Ross:

Yoav, as you sit here today and listen to me speak to you as someone who wants to make progress, we can recognize that as we share together today, anything and everything you say will be useful. Feel free to speak and challenge because that‟s part of the process of recognizing that something valuable is taking place. Tell us what you do and what you‟d like to get.

Yoav:

I apologize. English is not my first language, so I might have some mistakes in what I might say.

Ross:

You‟re doing well.

Yoav:

I work for one of the biggest Dead Sea products companies in the world. Probably most of you have heard about Dead Sea products. The company is a pretty new company. Four years ago, we started the company. We‟re having sales at approximately $150 million.

Ross:

Worldwide?

Yoav:

It‟s wholesale.

Ross:

You sell where?

Yoav:

Right now, the wholesale sales are for 600 locations all around the world, Australia, New Zealand, and recently Asia and Japan.

Ross:

Do you sell to other businesses?

Yoav:

Yes. I‟m working in a daughter company of this company doing direct sales. We just started.

Ross:

Can you tell us through what medium you do the direct sales? 211

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Yoav:

Has anybody here ever walked into a shopping mall and suddenly you notice that you were stopped? After 10 minutes, you think about what happened to you, and you notice that you‟re walking with two shopping bags in the mall? You just noticed that you bought a few cosmetic products.

Ross:

The women are saying yes, and the men not so much. That tells you something

Yoav:

It happened really quickly. Basically, that‟s the line of the business. We expose ourselves. Instead of being in a shop, we locate ourselves in the middle of a shopping mall so anybody who passes by sees us.

Ross:

I think I‟ve encountered you or a similar company where the girls come up and say, “Let me rub this on you.” I say, “Okay, whatever.” My students have sarged your employees.

Yoav:

I‟m sure they do. I‟m in this group of companies: a real estate company, an investment company, green energy and a cosmetic company. I‟m in this group working for the past three and a half years. I started as a salesperson. After that, I had a position as an operation manager in the offices.

Ross:

How were you as a salesperson? Were you good?

Yoav:

I started pretty bad, but I became better.

Ross:

How did you become better? Did you stop doing certain things and subtract them out, or did you start adding things in or both?

Yoav:

I did both.

212 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I‟m going to explore this for a minute, so stay with me. When you think about the things you began to extract and leave out, what were the top two or three things you stopped doing which improved your selling?

Yoav:

From the experience of encountering customers on a daily basis, you learn them. You see what works and what does not work. You always learn new tricks.

Ross:

That‟s a great belief to have. Specifically, what were some of the things you learned not to do? What did you learn to leave out and stop doing? Can you remember any of those?

Yoav:

I leave out un-useful information.

Ross:

What would that be?

Yoav:

It‟s anything I don‟t need to say, even if it is part of the material but is not actually helpful.

Ross:

That‟s a very good point. When you model excellence, you want to ignore the things that the expert ignores, avoid the things that the expert avoids, do what the expert does and notice what they notice. Keep going.

Yoav:

Basically, I started as a manager in the office and kept going to become an area manager. That‟s what I‟m doing right now. I‟m in charge of a few locations. Now I‟m getting to the reason I‟m here. It‟s a funny thing because my brother is involved with this group and he‟s opening for them an equity fund for private equity. He‟s also about to be a director in the cosmetic company.

213 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Right now, I‟m basically managing a few locations. I‟m in charge of training the salespeople. My job is to take care of everything, but the main thing is the numbers. One of the biggest challenges we encounter is one that Ross mentioned in the commercial letter for this course, and it‟s true. There are so many messages in those that it becomes hard to get people to hear a message, feel confident about you and to see you as the right person to give them the thing that is actually good for them. Ross:

You‟re inspiring me. One of the big challenges is the fact that most people are so over-stimulated and overwhelmed that they‟re not in a place to really listen. Another challenge and another equal opportunity is to ask yourself, “What are you really selling?” What is the maximum price range of your product? What is the most expensive product you have? What are the buy-in numbers?

Yoav:

We work on a system. We have a minimum price and a high price. The minimum would be $10 for soap, and the highest package price can range to $480.

Ross:

They‟d better give me a blow job for that, forget the soap. It‟s $480. Good for you.

Yoav:

It‟s a combination of products. It‟s not getting one product. It‟s somebody buying a huge amount.

Ross:

The first thing is to find models. One of the models that come to my mind is Starbucks. The idea that people will go in and pay $2, $4 or $6 for a coffee drink was pretty revolutionary when Starbucks 214

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

started. I remember that before Starbucks, coffee was 50 cents a cup. You got it at 7-Eleven. What Starbucks is really selling is an affordable indulgence. The second thing they‟re selling is something you can‟t model. It‟s a comfortable place where people can come together. It‟s a third place besides the home and the office. My view is that what you‟re really selling is not cosmetics or soaps. You‟re selling indulgence. You‟re selling a luxury indulgence item that people can buy without feeling like they‟re breaking the bank or overspending. You‟re also selling a splurge to someone who really wants to just spend money. The first understanding I would give you is that even though the cosmetic is the product, there‟s the product and there‟s the experience. I believe the experience that you‟re selling, and this is just my thought, is indulgence. The other thing you may be selling is gifts for clueless guys who don‟t know what to get a daughter, spouse or loved one. Primarily, women are buying for indulgence. The guys are buying because they‟re probably looking for a gift for someone else. There are metrosexual guys like me who like that kind of stuff and buy for ourselves to indulge. This is just my first thought. If you‟re going into marketing, there are persuasion challenges that I want to help you with and there‟s the marketing challenge. The marketing challenge is for me to say to you, “Do you have the demographics?” Can you say, “This percentage of our customers or these demographics buy this much”?

215 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I gave you this assignment. If you could describe the demographic age and gender of your ideal customer, and by ideal I mean the ones who spend the most, who are those people? Yoav:

I‟m actually going to this point because I think it‟s very important to say. What I feel is that we sell Dead Sea minerals. As well, we sell the idea that by using those minerals, you‟re being more beautiful, healthier looking, and all kinds of those images that people get when they buy cosmetics. They have all these ideas and dreams. Another thing about it, and I think it‟s even more connected to the subject that you deal with in your life, is that it‟s an anchor. It‟s something that everybody knows about. Most educated people know about the Dead Sea.

Ross:

I would challenge you on that. Many people don‟t know the Dead Sea. Hear me out. When I say “Dead Sea,” what comes to mind?

Participant:

The sea is dead.

Participant:

Either a nasty alkaline or a highly salty body of water.

Participant:

Bible imagery of the Dead Sea.

Ross:

Very few people associate it with anything that has to do with cosmetics, looking beautiful or feeling fresher. I understand that from the inside of your company you‟re seeing it through that filter, but the vast majority of people don‟t see that. You‟re Israeli and you know that the Dead Sea is where a lot of people go. I‟ve been there. The Dead Sea burned my ass because I had hemorrhoids at the time. I jumped out. It was bad. That‟s too much information. Don‟t go if you have something that itches. 216

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Do you understand what I‟m saying? I want to challenge you there. Most people don‟t know those things or have those associations. Yoav:

In marketing, the way we see it is that our competitors are Chanel, Estée Lauder and all kinds of companies who sell at a very high price. What makes the difference between us and them? Why not buy in a cheap place, like a $5 cream? Why pay more?

Ross:

Here‟s the lack of clarity. If you were in a retail outlet where people would have to say, “I‟m going in there to buy that product,” then you may have something going, but that‟s not the kind of purchase you‟re doing. People are on the move, and they‟re going to buy based on impulse and how well you sell in that moment, not the label of “Dead Sea Minerals.” The important factor is how effectively you sell them by appealing to what it really is all about, which is indulgence. If you lead with the Dead Sea, you‟re interrupting the experience and you‟re not matching most people‟s reality when they think of the Dead Sea. I didn‟t say you should leave it out, but don‟t lean on that and don‟t necessarily lead with it. Don‟t do the two L‟s, leading and leaning. Also, I have to ask you a practical question. Since it‟s not your company, how much leeway do you have? I‟ve had people come to me and say, “Can you design something for me?” I say, “Can you use it?” They say, “No, we have to do what the corporation gives us.” I say, “I can‟t help you.”

217 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Yoav:

The structure we have is very different from the American corporate structure. I‟m the area manager. I‟m a business partner in a way of the location that I am in charge of.

Ross:

How much leeway do you have in terms of what you tell the salespeople to say?

Yoav:

As much as I have, as long as it doesn‟t create anything legal or contradictory. The company brand and everything about the line is Dead Sea. Even the design will show it.

Ross:

Is there anything for the bath, aftershave or anal lubricant?

Yoav:

It‟s not mine.

Ross:

Is there ball powder? “Powder your balls with Seacret.”

Yoav:

That‟s not mine either.

Ross:

“I powder my balls with Seacret. I keep it a secret.” I like it. It would be cool to get a kiosk in an airport.

Yoav:

There is one in Israel.

Ross:

Does that do well?

Yoav:

I don‟t know.

Ross:

It‟s not really a kiosk. It‟s a Mossad station.

Yoav:

Everybody needs a little Mossad station. It‟s the idea that everything, even the design, is all going in one direction. I do agree that in the whole system, the cause of the act

218 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

of buying, not everything but the big amount of things, is the salesperson. Ross:

I also looked at this. There‟s far too much description that the salesperson has to give. “This comes from the Dead Sea.” Then you give a geography lesson. You narrate, “The Dead Sea is located approximately _____. The Dead Sea has _____.” No one wants to watch a travelogue like they did in the third grade while they‟re going through the experience of having the cream rubbed in. You need to drop a whole bunch of that. Here‟s the key. When you give people facts, figures and data, it goes to their left brain. You don‟t want to give them all those facts, figures and data because they don‟t care. Later on, once you see that they‟re engaged and they‟re enjoying it, you can throw some of that in. I‟ve been to these things, and to me they feel like an assault. The people are so aggressive. It‟s assault by hot girls so I put up with it. I bought one thing, like a soap. Then they tried to upsell me. I said, “No, you‟re being too aggressive.”

Yoav:

That‟s a good point that you raise. It‟s one of the biggest challenges, and we‟re trying to change it. It‟s become very common that a lot of big companies like Rosetta Stone are going into the middle of the shopping mall. There is so much competition with the other kiosks right now. So many people are used to being stopped all the time. People became harder to stop. When they are stopped, they‟re very closed.

219 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Let‟s come back to this question. Who is your ideal customer? Who is the person who buys the most stuff and the biggest packages?

Yoav:

I would say the ideal customer is a woman between 40 to 60 years old. She has a medium-high status, cares about looks and health, is down-to-earth and is not too snobby about having money.

Ross:

What is their average purchase? What is the average value of that customer? These are the kinds of numbers you need to know.

Yoav:

I would say $100.

Ross:

Of those people you focus in on and stop, how many are actually getting close to a $100 sale? Let‟s keep track of that question. I want to ask you a different question. Can you track your employees‟ sales? Can you tell that this employee did this much today and that employee did that much?”

Yoav:

Of course I can.

Ross:

How many stores are you in?

Yoav:

Right now we have three, and we‟re going to open more.

Ross:

Do you have one in the Beverly Center?

Yoav:

No.

Ross:

I know an Israeli girl who worked there briefly doing some of this stuff after her military service, just as you said.

220 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Of those three locations, can you tell me for each location who‟s the top salesperson? Not right now, but could you go back into your computer and pull up the name of the person? Yoav:

Forever?

Ross:

No, right now, currently.

Yoav:

Right now, everybody is new. We don‟t have experienced people except me and my partner.

Ross:

What is your process for teaching these people how to do it?

Yoav:

The process is when someone has arrived I work with him personally, one-on-one, for a few days. I work with him on the basics.

Ross:

Where do you work on him, in an office or actually in the field?

Yoav:

We start the first day learning all the material. I go through the material with him. Then I take him into the field and work with him. The first day, I am next to him. If he needs assistance, I get involved. In the next few days, I listen and give him remarks.

Ross:

How effective would you say you are in that initial transmission? First of all, on a scale of 1 to 100, how effective are you in understanding what it is you do that makes what you do work?

Yoav:

About 70. It‟s pretty good.

Ross:

I didn't say, “How good are you at doing it?” I said, “How good are you at understanding what you do?” How good are you at conveying that understanding to the employee? I‟m trying to see what can be tweaked. 221

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Yoav:

In conveying the information, I pass. I would say 80.

Ross:

How good are you at conveying the skill set to the employee? In other words, is your training procedure an effective procedure?

Yoav:

It is. If I compare myself to other people that do the same thing, it‟s usually more effective.

Ross:

I have a hit for you. When you train people, when you talk to them, do you tell them your own story? When I teach Speed Seduction®, I really get people's attention. They have no doubt, usually, that I can do this stuff. I say, “Here‟s what I want to let you guys know. I started with no skill with women, none whatsoever. I was the anti-skilled person. Everything you see that I have been doing is discipline and training. I had no natural talent at all.” Do you tell them your own story about how you started not being able to do any of this?

Yoav:

When it‟s needed, yes.

Ross:

No, not when it‟s needed. From now on, you should always do it. You should tell everyone. What are the beliefs of the people coming in? A lot of those people may have the belief that salespeople are born with it. Israelis are pretty aggressive. Maybe they believe they can do anything. You may not have that problem. I don‟t know, I‟m asking you.

Yoav:

No. Usually when they come, they have the perception of they‟re going to succeed. 222

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Very good then. I stand corrected. Let‟s look at this for a second. This is on the management and hiring side of it. If you hire 100 people, what percentage drops out in the first month?

Yoav:

Not too many. They don‟t usually drop because they are not successful. The reason people drop is because they come for a short period of time.

Ross:

That‟s just going to happen. You‟re not going to change that.

Yoav:

Exactly. I would say 15%.

Ross:

Here‟s the thing. I‟m walking through a shopping mall and some beautiful Israeli girl assaults me. She says, “Let me show you something, sir.” I feel assaulted. How many people have been through this experience? Shout out with some verbs. Don‟t agree or disagree with me just because I‟m here. Just tell me what you‟re really thinking. How would you describe that experience?

Participant:

Intrusive and evasive.

Participant:

Uncomfortable and controlled.

Participant:

Hijacked

Ross:

Most people probably feel that way.

Yoav:

That‟s what we‟re trying to do different.

223 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Let‟s get back to your customer. If we segmented your revenue, what percentage of your overall net revenue comes from women who are 40 to 60?

Yoav:

I would say at least 50%.

Ross:

How is the other 50% of revenue made up?

Yoav:

All kinds of the population.

Ross:

There‟s no way that percentage breaks down into demographics?

Yoav:

No. It‟s kind of hard to fit.

Ross:

I don‟t accept that answer as the permanent answer. I accept that as the current answer. I agree with you. If there is any way you can look at the demographics of the rest of that 50%, it may tell you something. My first perception is you need to train your salespeople, generally speaking, not waste their time. Know who not to talk to and who not to approach. Just in terms of sheer focus and concentration, those people are not worth talking to. Let‟s talk about that 50% of the people who are the women between 40 and 60. You‟ve sold people like this, right? You‟ve sold some stuff. Do they have a certain look in their eye or a certain state that they are in that tells you those people are looking for something or open to it?

Yoav:

Definitely. It‟s kind of hard to say. I have never seen a specific thing. Some people, like my business partner, can spot somebody a mile away and say, “I‟m going to sell that person.” 224

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That skill needs to be taught. First and foremost, I have just identified a skill that can be modeled, and it can be taught. Part of doing intelligence and security is to spot the people who you just have a sense that they‟re hinky. The cops use that term. Have you ever heard that term? “He‟s just hinky.” Spot the hinky, the guy with who, something is wrong. That skill set of your partner, do you have that skill set?

Yoav:

I have it as well as someone who has experience would have, but not as sharp as his.

Ross:

We need to, somehow, find a way to model your partner. I believe you can't convey the entire skill set. You can convey the mindset and the distinctions they look for. That would be huge. What if all your employees could be as good as he is? Guys who are really good at pulling girls in clubs, the real secret isn‟t the sixinch platform heels, the magic tricks, or the top hat. The real thing is to have enough experience to spot the girls who are looking to go home with someone that night. They ignore everybody else. They use everyone else as a prop to get the attention of the girl who wants to go home with them. If you have someone on your team who knows how to do this, that‟s a fantastic thing. If you could train all the people to be able to do that, right there you‟re getting leverage.

Yoav:

I think I agree. I wrote it as well. Training is a big challenge.

Ross:

It had been a big challenge. Now you claim and embrace massive success in the training.. 225

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Where are you located? Yoav:

In Kansas.

Ross:

If I said, "Get your partner on the phone with me for 10 or 15 minutes," could you do that?

Yoav:

I might be able to.

Ross:

If you can get him on the phone, I‟ll pick his brain. In fact, we can do a video conference. I‟ll get the key distinctions and give them to you so you can train your employees. I would say to the employees, “A big part of doing this is being able to spot who‟s the most likely customer so you don‟t waste your time. I know you don‟t want to hear a lot of no‟s and I don‟t want you to waste the time. One of the things we‟ll do is give you training in spotting the people who are the best candidates.” If you can really deliver that, that will improve employee morale and your bottom line at the same time.

Yoav:

There is one thing I would like to add. Another thing I think is one of the things we can't ignore is we try to choose who to stop. Basically, it‟s a luxury. It‟s only when you have the amount of people that you can choose from. Sometimes it‟s just who is in the shopping mall right now. That‟s whoever you have to stop. It‟s something you have to do.

Ross:

I agree. If it‟s busy and there are a lot of people, you want to pick the right ones.

Yoav:

You‟re trying to screen. 226

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

One thing you mentioned is training your sales force to hear “no” and if they are having a bad day, keep going. That, I can show you. This has to do energetically with when you put something out there, it‟s an expenditure of energy. What we can teach them to do is pull the energy back. Just do a visualization and movement where every time they extend the energy and it‟s over, they bring it back to themselves. I‟ll also teach them a little exercise to ground back into the present moment. When people feel frustrated, they leave the present moment. They go into the past and dwell on mistakes, or they go to the future and fantasize about something else. You can teach them that little grounding thing where they pull back up, and tell them if they do that they will be able to handle any number of nos. Basically, it‟s somewhat similar to cold calling. People who are good at cold calling just don‟t care when they are insulted. They don‟t take it personally. They go right on to the next person. Every call is the first call of the day. Milton Erickson had someone come to him who wanted to improve his golf game. He said, “Dr. Erickson, on the first three holes, I do really well. Then my game deteriorates.” Milton hypnotized him so every time he set his feet in a certain way and picked up the club, in his mind, it was the first and only shot of the day. He kept constantly making the first shot all day. He did really well. I‟m saying you don‟t need to go through a big, long trance induction. You can teach them a little exercise in visualization so they reset. Every person is the first person they talk to that day. That would be extremely useful. 227

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

It‟s a simple thing. I can show you that here, and then you can show them. We‟ll give you the footage so you can show them. If you‟re one of his employees watching this, the whole idea is this little thing will show you how to reset yourself. Every person you approach is the first person of the day. You‟re not hearing their no through a filter of five no‟s from that day and 10 no‟s that you anticipate. When you invest energy in it, you don‟t want to put too much enthusiasm. Too much enthusiasm will, first of all, block the other person‟s experience. It also means you have invested so much in the transaction, you might be pushy at the wrong time. You may avoid closing because you put so much in. Now you have to make it work. The other thing I would say to employees who are watching this is about the way in which you reset yourself so every person you approach is the first person of the day, and the way in which you manage your enthusiasm. Do you put too much enthusiasm into it? How much is too much? I would say it‟s a mistake to think that selling is about a peak experience. Peak experiences burn a lot of energy. They also blow the other person out of the water. I would say the more low key you are, the better. I don‟t mean depressive. Yoav:

You mean relaxed.

Ross:

The metaphor I give you is this. Years ago one of my gorgeous nephews came to me and said, “Uncle, I don‟t understand

228 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

something. How come I like Katy so much, but Katy doesn‟t like me?” I said, “Imagine this. There‟s a big pool of water that you share. That pool of water represents the energy available for liking someone. You have a seed of liking Katy and Katy has a seed of liking you. You‟re taking all that water away to water and grow your seed of liking her, so there is none left for her to water hers. Stop taking all of that.” The metaphor here is if you pour too much enthusiasm into the sale, you‟re interrupting the person‟s own natural procedure for developing their own enthusiasm. If they say no then wow, you‟ve really invested in it and now you‟re tired. Enthusiasm management is a really big thing. Here‟s what would help your employees. First of all, resetting after each experience. Reset after a yes and reset after a no. Each experience, each person is the first experience of the day. Then manage their enthusiasm. You‟re the best person to model that. You know how much enthusiasm gets in the way and how much doesn‟t. Yoav:

For me, it‟s different. I do a lot of meditation and stuff. For me, it‟s much easier to conceptualize this stuff. For them, it‟s more extreme. If it goes well, it goes well.

Ross:

That‟s what you have to stop them from doing. The people who don‟t play on extremes are the ones who are going to do best. They‟re not going to over-invest. They are also not going to be so

229 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

pushed to the point where they interrupt people's comfort. That‟s all I‟m saying. If you said, “If you meditate 10 minutes a day, you‟ll triple your sales,” they might do it. I don‟t know. Something has to be done to teach them that part. I‟ll demonstrate on video what you do, the resetting exercises. It‟s very simple. Yoav:

think the biggest thing I change is the vibe to relax and to help the other person enjoy every moment.

Ross:

Those are two pieces. Is this a sales script? Can I see it? They‟re narrating way too much. Can I see what you tell people to say? She‟s Israeli?

Yoav:

Jewish, but not Israeli.

Ross:

How old is she?

Yoav:

Twenty-four.

Ross:

Do they have to be Israeli girls? What kind of visa do they have?

Yoav:

All of them are US citizens in my company, or on a student visa.

Ross:

Can they work on a student visa?

Yoav:

Of course, on a working visa.

Ross:

What‟s the opening line, the first thing they say to get attention?

Yoav:

Can I ask you a question?

Ross:

You just did.

Yoav:

That‟s the opening. 230

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s bad. It‟s a terrible opening.

Yoav:

Free sample!

Ross:

No, I don‟t like that. “Free sample.” What‟s the other? “Can I ask you something?”

Yoav:

That‟s after someone stops and actually takes the sample.

Ross:

Do some people stop on their own without you stopping them?

Yoav:

Of course. They see it‟s a sample and they want to take one. Not too many, but still.

Ross:

Did you have something you want to contribute?

Participant:

I don‟t have a big mic presentation type thing. When you mentioned resetting before each prospect. I think that's really valuable. That‟s something that would benefit me in sales a lot. How would you do that?

Ross:

It‟s very simple. Here‟s what I do. I got this from teaching guys who think they are afraid of women. It‟s not fear, it‟s sexual excitement. They approach a woman who is smoking hot. They‟re so vibrating that their zipper is melting. That‟s bad for rapport. It‟s a very simple thing to reset. It involves just a few pieces. First of all, you feel the feeling of your feet in your shoes. Kinesthetically, you‟re going to ground and feel your feet in your shoes. You‟re going to bend your knees very slightly. When you bend your knees, you exhale. Inhale as you straighten up. The entire time, you want to keep your attention focused on the feeling of your feet against the ground. The feeling of your feet 231

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

pressing on the ground and the ground pressing back up on your feet so it‟s grounding. I even make a little sound in my head. You just bend slightly. It‟s not this like you‟re going to leap. It‟s just very slight, and exhale. Participant:

For how long?

Ross:

Do it like three times. You‟re already bending too much. It‟s a very slight bend. Take a long inhale. The key is to keep your attention focused on the feeling in your feet. If you do that three times, you‟ve reset yourself. Did you get that?

Participant:

Yes. Why does it help? What makes it work?

Ross:

It just resets your mind. It clears your mind. It‟s like hitting the reset button on the computer. I don‟t know exactly how it works, but it does. Try it for yourself. Has anyone here every used this in the field?

Participant:

Yes.

Ross:

Did it work?

Participant:

Yes, it dropped at least 40% to 50% of the intensity down.

Ross:

It‟s a way to control their intensity, and also put them back in the present moment. That‟s what they want to do. It‟s present-moment selling. I like that. That‟s a whole new product line. Lisa, take a note! “Welcome to Present-Moment Selling.”

232 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ben, have a seat. Where‟s your opening? You say, “Can I ask you a question?” or free sample? Ben:

Free sample. Do you want the process or the pitch itself?

Ross:

I‟m thinking of the opening. I don‟t like “free sample.” I would say this for the woman who‟s in her 40s through 60s. First of all, I don‟t like the idea of the same opening for each person. There‟s something wrong with that. You could design just three openings that are designed for the type of person you spot. Are you following what I‟m saying? Instead of saying, “Free sample,” what if you said something along the lines of, “Would you like to do something wonderful for yourself today? Have a look over here.” There‟s something about indulgence. “You look like you‟ve earned something wonderful,” or “You look like you‟ve earned something that will feel really great.” How about that?

Ben:

Once you‟ve stopped her or before?

Ross:

No, that‟s what you use to stop them. “You look like you‟ve earned something that will feel really great. Check this out.”

Ben:

There‟s one problem with it. It‟s not a problem about doing it. It‟s a problem with the rules of the shopping mall.

Ross:

What are the rules of the shopping mall?

Ben:

You usually cannot approach.

233 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I didn‟t say that. Here‟s your cart. This stage is your cart. How far from the cart can you go?

Ben:

You can go two or three steps. It‟s about this much.

Ross:

I‟m not saying to go any further, but instead of saying, “Free sample,” say, “You look like you‟ve earned something wonderful for yourself,” or something along the lines of indulgence. “You look like you‟ve earned something wonderful,” or “You look like you deserve something wonderful.” Say something like that. Instead of saying, “Free sample,” say, “Check this out.” When you say, “Free sample,” do you start rubbing it on them, or do they take it from the tray? How does it work?

Ben:

We let them pick. We say, “Do you want a hand cream?” We give them three or four choices. We have a hand cream, foot cream, and body lotion.

Ross:

You say, “You look like you deserve something wonderful for yourself. Check out these. When you feel like you really just want to relax and escape, do you prefer to make your skin glow, see how beautiful your nails look, or relax in something that makes the tub even better?” Do you get it? This is capturing their imagination and emotions and setting a mood rather than narrating about the Dead Sea. Do you rub it on their hands, or do they rub it on their own hands? What are the rules?

Ben:

You can do it with your own product. They‟re right now at the cart and getting a demonstration, so you can touch them if you want. 234

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

You have them here.

Ben:

I have a question for you. At this point, what we need to do is stop them. You don‟t always have time because a lot of people are in a rush. They say, “No, I don‟t have time.” You have a few seconds to bring them to the cart. How would you use this?

Ross:

Wait a minute. You have the free samples away from the cart, right?

Ben:

Yes, it‟s away from the cart. I would stand over here.

Ross:

You‟ve stopped them there with the free samples, right?

Ben:

It‟s after.

Ross:

You stop them by saying that. Do you understand? What did I say? “You look like you deserve something wonderful,” or “You look like you‟ve earned something wonderful.” You have to say it with the right tonality. Not “wonderful,” but “You look like you‟ve earned something wonderful.”

Ben:

It‟s the right word with the right person.

Ross:

Right. “You look like you‟ve earned something wonderful,” or “You look like you deserve something wonderful.” Then you ask the question, “When you really want to indulge yourself, do you like the way your skin looks when it glows with something fantastic? Do you like looking really beautiful? Do you like the feeling of just soaking into something that just relaxes every muscle?”

235 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Give some sensory description and look how their face nonverbally responds. If they go like this when you‟re describing the nails, that‟s the one you want to push forward. When you see the nonverbal response like that one, that‟s the one you really want to push. Here‟s my question. I‟m asking you because I don‟t know. When you start putting the sample on them, do you do it from the little tray, or do you have to go over to the cart? Ben:

I‟d go over to the cart.

Ross:

Do you have to sell them from the cart? Can‟t you sell them right there if the samples are there?

Ben:

To sell them, I have to bring them over to do the whole process and selling sequence.

Ross:

One idea I had is you can sell them right here and then complete the transaction over here.

Ben:

I do that sometimes, but not too much.

Ross:

It‟s not about physically bringing them over to the cart yet. Hold on. Hear me out. The first and most important step is getting them actively involved and invested in their imagination. You have to do that. It‟s like, “I have to get the girl‟s phone number,” and I say, “What if you get the girl dripping wet, begging for your zion?” That‟s Hebrew for penis. You get her all hot and bothered for that. Then the phone number becomes a logistical detail. I agree. You have to get them over here. Let‟s say they‟re into this and they‟re enjoying it. You say, “Let me show you how this really 236

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

works over here.” You get them over there, and you‟re doing more of the demonstration process. Once you have them there, you can give them some of the details. “As you can see, this comes from the Dead Sea. Most people don't know it has the best concentrate.” But don‟t do too much of that. If you do too much of it, they‟re going to feel like you‟re trying to sell them. What‟s your pattern for getting them to buy? What do you say to introduce them? Ben:

In what point of the process?

Ross:

In the point of the process where you‟re now closing them. What‟s your closing process? What‟s the pitch that gets them to buy?

Ben:

Let‟s say I show cosmetics to a lady. I would show her a few products, like a serum, eye cream or gel. I would demo her and see how she reacts. I‟d tell her what she‟s getting and why it‟s good for her. Then I would ask her, “What did you like the most?” I try to focus on one product.

Ross:

How do you begin to discuss price?

Ben:

I‟m telling her the quality and what it gives her. I tell her the prices and why it‟s good for her. I give a few arguments why it‟s really good and what the difference is. The arguments make the product look even better. Then I‟d let her choose what she‟d use. If she chooses, then she keeps going with me.

Ross:

What words do you say to elicit the choosing? What do you say? Do you say, “It‟s time to choose now, bitch!”? What do you say? 237

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ben:

“From everything I just showed you, which one did you like the most? Which do you think you‟d use the most?”

Ross:

I don‟t like that language. I‟d say, “Which one of these grabs you most?” or “Which one of these can you see yourself using now?” I really think that would be cool. Instead of saying, “Which one did you like the most?” point to all of them and say, “Which one can you really see yourself using?” Some people just pick one, but other people think to themselves, “I want them all.” Did you hear that? Change that piece of pattern. “Which one of all of these?” Did you hear that? “Which one of all of these can you see yourself using?” Give that slight head nod. Can you get my head nod? “Which one of all of these can you see yourself using?” You say, “I don‟t know.” Use the false profession of ignorance. Pace them. Say, “As you‟re enjoying these,” how are they enjoying these and which one of these? “As you‟re enjoying these, I don‟t know which of all of these you like the best.” Do you get it? “I don‟t know which of all of these you want to take home,” is even better. “I don‟t know which of all of these you can see yourself having.” How do you like that? “I don‟t know which of all of these,” meaning you‟re going to get all of them. Get it? “As you‟re enjoying yourself,” or, “As you‟re enjoying these, I don‟t know which of all of these you can see yourself having and really, truly enjoying. “I want to let you know I hate it when salespeople,” point away from yourself to another cart, “throw packages and all that stuff at you.

238 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I‟m just about being up front and talking to you respectfully as an adult. Here are my prices. Here‟s what I have.” Do you understand? Ben:

You‟d like to be more honest and more up front.

Ross:

You‟re saying, “As you‟re enjoying that, I don‟t know which of all of these you can see yourself having,” or “you can see yourself enjoying.” Do you get it? There‟s a command. “What I did want to let you know is personally, I hate it when there are those salespeople who try to give you all those packages and offers. All I want to do as you think about taking these home is just show you what my upfront prices are. Here‟s what it is. I want to trust that you as an adult can make your own decision based on facts that feel right for you.” Do you get it? “I want to trust that you,” means you‟re trusting them. “I want to trust that you as an adult can make your own decision based on what seems right to you.” You like this. That will totally dissipate this. All that language is there on this. When you say, “Here‟s the package I have today. It‟s $59.95, but just for you today it‟s $49.95,” how many people believe that? How many people say, “Bullshit, jackoff!”?

Ben:

Actually, it‟s too many.

Ross:

It‟s too many, so stop doing it.

Ben:

Let me ask you a question. Would you do the same process, but put the prices before what you said?

Ross:

No. Capture their imagination and emotions. Have them imagine enjoying the product. 239

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ben:

Then do I give the prices?

Ross:

Then give the prices.

Ben:

Then do I do the other effect?

Ross:

No, not if you present it the right way. Say, “As you‟re enjoying all of this, I just want to let you know that personally I hate those salespeople who try to throw packages and false discounts at you. I‟d rather treat you as an adult and honestly say this is my livelihood. Here are the prices for each of these things.” Do you understand? Then back up a step. Physically take half a step back and say, “Here are the prices for all these things.” Then nod your head.

Ben:

To keep in the regular sequence I use, I say, “Which one do you choose?” if she doesn‟t choose.

Ross:

No, let them choose. You‟ve already said, “As you‟re enjoying yourself, I don‟t know which of all of these.” You‟re giving the suggestion by saying “all of these.” “I don‟t know which of all of these you can picture having the most or enjoying having the most.” Do you understand what I‟m saying? They‟re either going to select one out or they‟ll select all of them. “I just want to let you know that often this is the point where those kinds of salespeople would try to give you all kinds of fake deals and fake discounts. I don‟t do that. Here‟s what the prices are. Here‟s what I sell this for.”

240 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I remember when I was a kid, I‟d get the prize for selling candy bars door to door. I said, “Hello, sir. I‟m here to sell you something today.” I thought I‟d start out by being totally up front and honest. “In fact, what I‟m selling is overpriced compared to what you‟d buy in the store, but it‟s for a really good cause, and here‟s why. This chocolate bar for $1, you could probably buy for 50 cents, but you‟re not just buying the candy bar. You‟re buying the sense that you‟re helping a young entrepreneur develop a good work ethic.” I knew that even then. I outsold everybody. Do that instead of trying to be slick, which no one buys. You‟re being slick in a way that they won‟t catch. You want to point away from yourself. “I have to say that there are those salespeople that try to give you phony packages. I‟d rather trust that as an adult…,” meaning you‟re the adult or they‟re the adult. Do you see the scope ambiguity? “I‟d rather trust that as an adult,” not “I‟d rather trust that you as an adult.” Say, “I‟d rather trust that as an adult, it‟s just a better idea to show up front what my prices are.” Did you get the language there? Ben:

I got the language, but I have a question. The idea of using the word “salesperson,” you don‟t think is problematic?

Ross:

No, I don‟t think so at all. They know you‟re selling. They see the cash register and the card machine. They get it. You can go stand in front of it so they don‟t see it, but do you get what I‟m saying? “At this point I have to tell you that I hate it when those kinds of salespeople,” point away from yourself to the other carts, “will come up with all sorts of phony discount packages. I‟d rather trust as an 241

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

adult,” or “I‟d rather trust as someone who‟s all grown up,” but watch that one. “I‟d rather trust as someone who‟s an adult,” or “Speaking to you as an adult who understands what‟s really going on.” Pace it. “Speaking to you as an adult who understands what‟s really going on.” Nod your head. Now you‟re giving them something to live up to. “Speaking to you as an adult who understands what‟s really going on, this is how I earn my living, so I just want to show you what my prices are and offer it to you right now,” and then step away from it. They‟re going to say, “Wow! That was so respectful of me.” You pace it. You say, “I have to tell you, I hate the kind of salespeople who give you phony packages like, „Today, we‟re going to take $10 off‟ because we both know it‟s nonsense. But I‟d rather trust as an adult that you can make a decision based on what you really want. Understanding that this is how I earn my living, here are my prices.” Do something along those lines. Would you not feel respected at that point? They‟ll think, “Wait a minute. This person isn‟t trying to snow me. They‟re acknowledging that there are obnoxious people salespeople. They‟re showing and telling me that they‟re not going to do that. They‟re going to trust me as an adult.” Ultimately, that‟s what you should do. People will feel respected. Paradoxically, they will buy more. Instead of pressuring them, you‟re subtly leading their imagination and their emotions.

242 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

I would feel so much more respected if they said, “Look. I really hate those salespeople who do phony packages and pressure. I‟d rather trust as an adult that you‟re someone who can make your own decision if you‟re just given the facts. This is how I earn my living, so I just want to show you the prices for these, what the investment is.” Try it. If you try this consistently for a week, the worst that can happen is that it doesn‟t work, but I think it will. Participant:

Could I make a suggestion? I think that one thing you need to look at if you haven‟t studied SpeedSeduction® is that this is a seduction. You‟re live and in the moment with somebody. Ross hasn‟t really talked about it this weekend, but you need to train your salespeople to use proper tonality and slow down. You also need to do studies of the malls you‟re in and the demographic you‟re hoping to reach, maybe staff it with different people at different hours and have them dress appropriately.

Ross:

Let‟s go back to your first point which I think is beautiful. You also need to train your people to not speak too quickly. Speak at a pace that gives people time to develop their hypnotic responses. If you see your employees going really fast, slow them down.

Participant:

When you speak fast like that, you actually come across as a salesperson. They‟re not gaining rapport with you. They‟re just there to make the quick sale and you‟re gone. When you really demonstrate and respond to them, people are much more open to actually purchasing.

243 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

If you do this right, you don‟t even have to give the geographic lecture about the Dead Sea. Leave it out. They won‟t care. You could call it Buckwheat‟s Ass Farm. “Hi, I here from Buckwheat‟s Ass Farm Salt Minerals.” You lead them through the process in a way that engages their imagination and uses scope ambiguity. Remember, scope ambiguity allows you to slide things in. “I‟d rather trust as an adult that you can make your own decisions in an honest way.” Do you mean that you trust them or you trust yourself? What decisions? Are you being honest, or are they being honest?

Participant:

They have to decide.

Ross:

Right. Say that this is how you earn your living, nothing comes for free and here are the honest prices today. The presupposition is that you‟re being honest with them and there is no negotiation. I would say that.

Mike:

I would also just suggest that you not set this up as high pressure. That turns a lot of people off and you start getting desperate. If they‟re not going to buy right now, set it up with something like, “Thank you for sharing.” Notice I didn‟t say who is sharing their time with what. “Please feel free to come back anytime you want to experience more pleasure.” I‟ve often found that as people walk around the mall, with each step they take, they envision the pleasure they can receive from this product and they come back. You say, “You‟re more than welcome to come back any time. Thank you.”

244 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

That‟s fantastic! Pace the fact that half of them or more are going to walk away. That was great process language. Thank you, Mike. All this stuff about the Dead Sea minerals, if they ask you where it comes from, tell them briefly, and then get off and get right back to the central, imaginative part of the experience.

Yoav:

We use it only one time, when we start in a different direction.

Ross:

Don‟t narrate with this. See how much you can subtract out of the narration because the narration takes away from the experience. You‟re making it about narrating rather than guiding the experience that you help them to have. It‟s a big distinction. I know you‟re going to do really well.

Participant:

I‟m getting a visual sense here because you‟re going into it face to face. Can you give us a live visual example of how you could steal their anchors and do the filter to the products?

Ross:

I don‟t think he needs to do that here, and there may not be enough response written to do this here. Let‟s not layer that in at the moment. Throughout this process, they don‟t feel that you‟re trying to pull a fast one on them. They never feel pressured. Mike just dumped $10,000 a month into your lap with that. Mike, that was brilliant. Thank the Ice Man for us. I would really like to see him or talk to him on the phone or whatever. He‟s a good guy. We know some interesting characters.

Participant:

I have two contributing comments and one really important question. When you were talking about “glistening skin” or “bathtub improvement” or whatever, it sounded like the X, Y or Z, all of which 245

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

are propitious for you because all of those make a sale. I just thought that was awesome because it‟s a cool example. Ross:

Experiment with that language. I may be off with it, but you get the general idea.

Participant:

The second one was in guarding the reset. It‟s not like running, doing a lift or something visceral. It‟s subtle.

Ross:

Subtle is significant, as my teacher, Shinzen, taught me.

Participant:

I‟ve experienced moments where I create a lot of interest or a trance. I get the interest component of a sale registering. It‟s going, but then I blank on the lines, on all these good scripts. What do you do to not line blank, basically?

Ross:

Cancel! Clear! None of us blanks. We‟re all going to remember everything we need to, so his suggestion fell flat. I would say the following. First of all, have a clear understanding of where you need to go next and what you‟re going to do next. Rehearse out loud where you‟re going to go next. Understand how what you‟re rehearsing out loud works and what it‟s designed to do. Practice them out loud, and also analyze how they work and what principles are at play. Tie in the memorization with your understanding of the concepts, and the memorization will work. Rehearse out loud with the body movements you would make. You are speaking it to make it more real and feeling it through the kinesthetics of your body.

Mike:

You work your butt off, and you have this customer. What do you do after the sale to sell them more? 246

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Yoav:

We have a system that once somebody took a product at the full price, depending on what product they took, we show them a variation of it.

Ross:

That‟s not what he means. He means after they‟ve gone home. Do you have contact information? Do you follow up with a postcard or letter?

Mike:

What do you do?

Yoav:

It‟s kind of hard in this business to do a follow up, and we don‟t do anything like that.

Mike:

I can probably double your business in 18 to 24 months.

Ross:

How?

Mike:

First, for every person who purchases from you, get their name, address where they live and all that stuff. This is really critical.

Ross:

With all due respect, I understand where you‟re going, but it may get in the way of the cash purchase. When they‟re buying cash, you don‟t do this because they‟re not going to want to fill that all out. I completely understand where you‟re going.

Mike:

You have to get them hooked to get that information.

Yoav:

This kind of sale is very dynamic and quick. The people who were in the middle of walking just want to keep walking.

Ross:

If they were in a retail store in a fixed location, I would understand. This is a cart where people are on the move and time is of the essence.

247 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

I would get a lot of them still. I would probably close by saying, “I can get you on our list. That way if we have any specials or other opportunities, I could just send you something. Would you be interested in that?”

Ross:

He‟s right, but here‟s how I would do it. After they‟ve completed the purchase, they‟ve given you the money and are walking away, I would say, “By the way, if you want to be kept informed when we have new products that we‟re introducing, you can come back, or if you‟d like, you can get on our mailing list.” I would do it only after the sale is over.

Mike:

I agree 100%

Ross:

I would not say, “Would you like to?” I would say, “By the way, you can try it.”

Mike:

You absolutely want to do this after the sale. You don‟t want to interrupt the sale process at all. I agree with you. Get the money. Now that you have the money, get the address because here‟s what‟s going to happen.

Ross:

I just thought of something. During the procedure where you‟re bringing them over to the cart from the tray, you can say, “Come by the cart for a second.” Do you hear the ambiguity? “Come „buy‟ the cart for a second.” You could also say, “One of the by-products of indulging yourself today is that it just feels great to indulge yourself today.” Do you get it? One of the “buy-products”? Come “buy” the cart? Try those ambiguities.

Participant:

Do single women want to give up their address? 248

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

No.

Participant:

So you get an email address.

Mike:

Sure. You get an email address or some kind of correspondence address.

Ross:

Hold on. I want you to get that ambiguity. Those ambiguities isolated from the whole thing don‟t work. Instead, you‟re using the scoped ambiguity to slide in the presupposition that it‟s about trust. You‟re setting it up that they don‟t view it as a sale, but rather as an indulgence. You‟re setting it up so that when you close them, you‟re not going to do the stuff that other people do. Instead, you‟re pacing. You continue to stay with them by pacing. Right at the close, you don‟t say, “I have these packages today. Here‟s the $49.95, but just for you, it‟s $39.95, and I‟ll throw in the ass cream.” What happens when people do that to you? What‟s your response? It‟s, “F. you! I‟m out of here, buddy. I‟m not stupid. “ Instead, you take all of that stuff, all the negativity, and you spatially anchor it to other people who are in the mall. Use what‟s in the context in your favor. In the context in which you do this, you said there are all these other carts around. All these other people are most likely using the high-pressure stuff correct?

Yoav:

Yes.

Ross:

Personally, I hate those salespeople who offer all these dumb packages. “I‟d rather trust as an adult that you can make a decision for your own reasons.,” or “You can find yourself making a decision for your own reasons,” and nod your head.

249 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Everything is working together. Then what I‟m saying is that as part of the process of that, you throw in the ambiguities, like “Come by the cart,” “By the way” or “One of the by-products of using this today.” When we used to sell stuff, we used to haul boxes full of stuff when I would do seminars. I used to say that, and people would run to the back of the room. My partner at the time didn‟t want to be bothered with bringing products. We lost about 30% of our seminar revenue because he didn‟t want to be bothered with it. Subsequently, he ceased to be my business partner. Mike:

Once I capture either their email or mailing address, and I would rather have their mailing address, I would then put them into a customer relation management (CRM) program. The one I use is Infusionsoft.

Ross:

Are you allowed by your corporate headquarters to do mailings?

Yoav:

I think it‟s probably something in general that they would be interested in.

Ross:

Technically speaking, if you‟re doing credit cards, you have to get an address even though you‟re not mailing it to them. When they fill out the credit card form, don‟t they have to fill out their name and address?

Yoav:

No, it‟s just sliding it.

Ross:

Be very careful how you do this process. I would do it after they have bought and are walking away from the cart. I would say, “By the way, just to let you know, from time to time we do have

250 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

specials. If you‟d like to stay in touch by mail, I can offer you this, and you can fill in your address.” Don‟t ask for it. Mike:

You could also have samples or opportunities to save money

Ross:

I‟m saying don‟t ask for it. Don‟t say, “Would you like to be on the mailing list?” That triggers the automatic no response.

Yoav:

In answer to you, we do actually have a POS. It‟s a system that does all that. It keeps a record of what they bought.

Mike:

You‟re also going to want to differentiate your customers. In my own business, I use the Pareto principle or the 80/20 rule. This is really critical. I find that 26.4% of my customers give me 80% of my money.

Ross:

He and his partner are able to spot those people 100 feet away. Going in, you teach your employees to get that. You not only get it in the back end when you sift the data, but you get it in the front end by calibrating people.

Mike:

You want to have a little newsletter that you send out to keep in touch once a month. I would have a customer profile. It‟s really just a glorified testimonial on how they use their products and how wonderful people tell them they look. Beyond that, you want to send them offers. Split your list out with the people who spend the most money with you.

Ross:

With all due respect, Mike, now you‟re getting into a whole detailed process. Wrap it up.

Mike:

You definitely want to get the list, send them stuff and make them offers because there‟s a lot of money on the table. Also, when they 251

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

leave, give them samples and what‟s called a “bounce back,” a little coupon to bring them back to the cart at a later date. Ross:

That‟s a good idea.

Yoav:

That would be part of the system.

Ross:

That‟s a money idea.

Mike:

You want to do that as well, something to bring them back.

Ross:

Here‟s what you do. Don‟t hand it to them. You include it in the package so they find it when they open it up.

Participant:

After they‟ve made a purchase and re walking away, you can say, for example, “On your birthday, you can come in and we‟ll give you a gift.”

Ross:

It‟s a possibility. What I don‟t want to do is distract you away from the main pieces.

Yoav:

That‟s what I would like to focus on.

Ross:

All the languaging is here in the video, but I want to make it very clear. Think of the tools I taught you about scope ambiguity. When you introduce that scope ambiguity, where they don‟t know who‟s being referred to, they will accept the frame that this is not a high-pressure sell, but that you‟re offering them an opportunity to indulge themselves in something they want to do anyway. Avoid that closing process where you throw in all the bad. When you throw all these things that they‟re used to, it‟s firing off negative anchors. If you avoid that and spatially anchor it out to other 252

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

people, then you dissipate that. Then they can throw all of those feelings over there. It‟s like doing a boyfriend destroyer, I take all the negativity, anchor it to the boyfriend and push it away from me. In a sense, he‟s right. Who said it was a seduction? It‟s absolutely a seduction, not a rape. I‟m serious about that. It‟s a seduction, not molestation, groping or rape. The problem is that as I ask people their experience, they feel like they‟ve been fingered. That‟s what you‟re doing. Everything I‟m doing here is driving it to be something much more enjoyable. Yoav:

It‟s classy.

Ross:

It‟s classy and enjoyable. They walk away feeling, “I didn‟t just get sold.” They feel, “I just did something really great for myself ha, ha, ha. Wait until I tell my girlfriends.” I‟m excited about this because I want you to see how all of this ties together with all of the tools I was showing you this morning. It all works together.

Yoav:

Of course, it‟s all about language. What about the structure of the pitch for the main product I showed you for the nails?

Ross:

I understand what you‟re saying. You‟re saying, “How much narration should they do?” You‟re demonstrating to them how to use the product. Is that correct?

Yoav:

It‟s something that you have to do quickly. Somebody is in a rush. It‟s two seconds from the moment you spot him, catch him and bring him to the cart. 253

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Here‟s the wrong piece. I apologize. It‟s not wrong. The sequence is out of order. Remember that I said there‟s consistent excellence, which is excellence in the things you never stop doing. There‟s sequential excellence. which is excellence in the things you do as part of a series of steps. There‟s recursive excellence, which is excellence in the things that you return to periodically. This is a matter of sequential excellence. First, you want to capture and lead their imaginations and frame it as an indulgence. Only when you‟ve done that do you do the demonstration. I don‟t care if you keep saying the same things as you demonstrate, but don‟t go too long. This is a matter of calibration. Some people want to hear a lot of facts before they purchase. Other people don‟t want to hear a lot of facts. You‟re going to narrate them. Let‟s say you were showing someone how to use it. I‟m a woman. You‟re going to do me. Show me. You buff me, or what do you do?

Yoav:

You do it like this.

Ross:

Oh, it feels wonderful.

Yoav:

At the same time, it‟s everything you read in the materials. It‟s not like before. It‟s during the demonstration.

Ross:

I understand. How much time do you take?

Yoav:

It takes about five minutes, maybe three or four minutes.

254 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I‟d say a couple of things. First of all, calibrate. Are they following you or not following you? From time to time say, “How does that feel?” or “Doesn‟t that feel great?” or “Are you enjoying this?” That gives them what I call the illusion of participation. This is something I lean on heavily when I teach the seduction courses. You want to give someone the illusion that they‟re participating with you by saying, “Are you enjoying this? Would you like to see more? Does that feel good?” What do they do? Now you‟re meta-stating them. They‟re popping out of the experience and evaluating it. You‟re fractionating them because they‟re having the primary experience. You‟re giving them the illusion of participating with you. You‟re giving them the sense that they‟re invested and involved. They don‟t feel it‟s something you‟re doing to them. I would intersperse within the demonstration little questions like, “Doesn‟t that feel good? Are you enjoying this? Do you like how that feels?” Then calibrate their answer. If they say, “Yes, I really like it,” then you know you have to lay off. You have to back up a minute.

Yoav:

Why?

Ross:

They‟re not enjoying it. Maybe it‟s not the product they want. The other thing you have to be really careful about is if you go up to them with a nail product, what if they really want the skin cream and you‟re interrupting it?

Yoav:

I would say this process, because it happens so quick, sometimes people go to some kind of trance. 255

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I‟m all for trance, believe me.

Yoav:

Sometimes you‟d take a big motorcycle guy with a beard who has tattoos, the last person who would buy something for nails, and you would think he‟d slap you in the face in a second. But when you go through the process, suddenly he reacts totally different from the way you thought. He says, “Wow! I like it. I‟ll take it for myself.”

Ross:

What percentage of people are like that?

Yoav:

Most of the weird people you think wouldn‟t buy, do buy. It‟s hard to explain.

Ross:

Hold on. Sit back down, because you gave me a gem there. Say that again.

Yoav:

Most of the weird people that you don‟t expect to buy, will buy it.

Ross:

Most of the weird people that you don‟t expect would buy, would buy.

Yoav:

Yes, people that pass next to you and you say, “I would never even try to sell them,” just for fun, I would.

Ross:

Say that again. Say it one more time.

Yoav:

I would stop them just for fun.

Ross:

That‟s why you‟re really good at doing this. Take that mindset and train your employees to challenge themselves. That‟s the least likely person to do it. Can we get that person to do it? Part of this is modeling your skill set. It‟s not just telling people what to say and educating them as to how it works. It‟s modeling your skill set. If I think, “There‟s no way that would work on that person,” 256

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

that‟s why I‟m going to try it. I‟m going to get excited about the challenge. You could set up a test. Part of your challenge is screening for the right employees, right? You could screen to see if your employees have that aspect to them. I don‟t know how you would set that test up, but you could preselect for people who have that orientation. My job when I‟m teaching Speed Seduction® is to train guys to have that orientation. They‟re so afraid of making a mistake that it‟s the last way they‟ll think. Part of my skill set as a teacher is to reengineer their mind so they‟ll get excited about things that look impossible. Yoav:

Maybe give them a kick. With me, it‟s like somebody would tell me, “I‟ll give you anything if you sell this person.” I would say, “No problem.” Something like that, you mean?

Ross:

Some kind of challenge. I don‟t know. I have to think that one through. It‟s part of the follow-up process. Lisa, give me the assignment to think that through and remind me. What was your contribution?

Lisa:

You come up to me from the cart. You have a line of face products. I walk over. If I were to buy one product or more, in the back of my mind, the decision would be, “How would I buy more?” If it‟s face products and works, I want to buy more. Do I have to find this cart again, figure out which store it‟s in front of? Also, a cart doesn‟t seem to be like a retail store, which I expect to be there again. This cart may not be there again. Do you offer them

257 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

a card? Do you offer them a website and say, “We‟re online. We have all of this. If you want to order more, this is what you can do”? Ross:

It‟s very simple to set it up. You say, “Here‟s my card for when you want to come back for more.” Then just nod your head. Since you‟re in such rapport with them, they‟ll say, “Yes, I want to come back for more.” This is evil. I used to do this on chicks. I don‟t do it anymore. I learned it from a guy I heard do it in a sales presentation. I thought, “That‟s good. I have to do this one.” I used to do this to girls back in the early „90s. I would say to myself, “Let‟s see how far we can push this. I want them to call me and ask me out. How can I set that up?” Does someone have a business card I can borrow? I almost thought of it as a magic trick. I‟ll show you this. This is wicked. This is really a sick trick, but I want to give you your money‟s worth. She‟s right, but there‟s a way to do it. I would say, “At some point in the coming week, when you find yourself thinking about this conversation, you‟ll think to yourself, „I want to talk to that guy again. I have to call him.‟ You‟ll look for my number right here on this card.” Their eyes would go glassy, their pupils would dilate, and they‟d take the card. If their pupils didn‟t dilate, I knew they wouldn‟t call me. Here‟s the weird thing, and you guys might have an inside on this as hypnotists. If their pupils did dilate, half of them would call that

258 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

night, but the other half would call within 48 to 72 hours. If it went beyond 72 hours, they never called me. I just think some people need more time to process the suggestion. What do you think is going on there? Participant:

It could be any number of things. That could be one of them.

Ross:

I think their processing time takes time to float back up into their conscious mind. I would say, “At some point in the coming week when you find yourself really being glad you did this, you might want to come back again.” Then hand them the card. “At some point in the coming week when you find yourself wanting more of this,” what is the "this" they‟re going to want more of? That makes it ambiguous, so they have to process it. “At some point in the coming week when you find yourself wanting more of this, you can look for us right here in this card.” Then let them take it from you.

Yoav:

You can do it with anybody whether they buy or not.

Mike:

Change your paradigm. Everything you‟ve talked about is, “How do I sell this person?” Everything that everyone else here has told you is, “How do you put a smile on this person‟s face instantly and make them feel so good about what you‟re doing and your interaction with them that they want to buy?” You‟re encouraging them to come back and making it easy for them to buy in the future. As an example, you‟re my new salesperson. I‟m not going to say, “How are you going to sell these people?” My question to you would be, “How are you going to make these people feel so good 259

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

instantly that they come back and buy from you?” That‟s the paradigm shift you have to make. Ross:

I‟d say that half of selling effectively is avoiding and extinguishing the anchors that everyone else uses. If you can take the anchors that people are used to experiencing in that area of life and don‟t do them, that alone will double your sales.

Yoav:

Can you give an example?

Ross:

In the area of beautiful women, if you avoid doing what all the losers do, you have your foot in the door. Don‟t stare at their boobs, tell them how beautiful they are 100 times, or ask them out immediately before you even talk to them. Just by not doing what every other jerk does, just by avoiding the bad stuff, you‟re already halfway in the door. It‟s even more so with selling. If you avoid firing off the anchors that make people feel pressured or ripped off, then you‟re already halfway in the door.

Yoav:

So that‟s what we talked about before?

Ross:

The problem with all of this is that, up until now because you‟re no longer going to use that anymore, you were firing off a lot of the anchors that say, “I‟m selling you. You‟re being tricked or pressured.” Here‟s the paradox. I‟ve been stopped at these things. The girls are really hot, but they make me feel pressured. Even I don‟t want to mess around with a hot chick so you know you‟re off track.

Yoav:

What about increasing sales? 260

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Increasing the unit?

Yoav:

No, increasing the individual person. Let‟s say I have a customer. I would like to make him ready for another product.

Ross:

I showed you that. Hold on, I‟m going to get there. Remember, I said, “I don‟t know which of all of these,” and the suggestion is to take all of them.

Yoav:

Let‟s say he passed through this point. He chose one product. He has a certain amount he would like to spend. He says, “I‟ll take this.” We go to the register. How would I increase the sale from $70 to $300? How would I increase it for the individual person?

Ross:

You have to make a choice. My perception is that if you do this right, your unit of sale is going to go up anyway because people are so happy they‟re going to be taking more stuff to the register. If they‟re taking more stuff to the register because they want to buy all of it, you won‟t need to upsell them or be able to upsell them because they would have already bought everything.

Yoav:

But I want to increase it. There is no limit. If somebody has $600 in the register, I want them to buy $1,200.

Ross:

You think like an Israeli, and I admire that. I have to honestly really think about that. You‟re saying they‟re already into it.

Yoav:

That‟s the system.

Ross:

What you‟re conceptualizing is that you want to do a last-minute upsell when you‟re selling them.

Yoav:

I want to increase the sales as much as I can until the person tells me, “I‟m all set.” 261

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I would avoid that. I would really avoid that. We‟re doing everything we can to avoid firing off those anchors, and then at the last minute when they‟re taking out the cash you‟re going to fire off the anchors. The equivalent is that you have the girl. She‟s back at your place. She can‟t wait to get naked. Then you do something totally stupid like say, “I‟m in love with you.” By the way, once I get with a girl, I never leave her alone. Exit stage left.

Yoav:

Let me specify what I mean. When you go to the cinema, they tell you, “If you spend 20 cents more, instead of a small sized Coke, you‟ll get a medium size.” I‟m talking about something like that.

Ross:

It‟s like a last-minute bumper.

Yoav:

You already have this and this. You like everything I showed you.

Ross:

When you go to the cinema, the presupposition by walking through the door is that you want the product. When you go to the cinema, the presupposition is that you‟re not going to the cinema just to buy the popcorn by virtue of the fact that you‟ve gone through the door. You‟re saying that you want to be there. The equivalent would be if you go to the cinema, and you only pay your admission ticket after you‟ve bought your stuff. You buy the admission ticket first. Then you buy your other stuff. They haven‟t even bought the admission ticket because you haven‟t really gotten the money and closed the sale.

Yoav:

I would ask them to pay. I would say, “How would you like to pay?” Then I would do it.

262 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I would say, “Oh, by the way.”

Yoav:

By the way.

Ross:

“By the way, if there‟s something else you‟d like today, I do have this. I don‟t want to push it on you.” Then pull it away from them. Say, “If there‟s something else you‟d like today,” then point at it, “I do have this” Then pull it away. If they reach for it, sell it to them. If they don‟t, they‟re done. Say, “Oh, by the way, I do have something else. It‟s this much, if you‟d like this today.” Then see what they do. Twenty percent of the people in the population are highly suggestible people. What percentage of the general population are somnambulistic subjects? They‟ll make anything real.

Participant:

It‟s about the same, 20%.

Ross:

Twenty percent of the time, you‟re going to be dealing with a highly suggestible, somnambulistic subject who will accept any reality, especially at the end of a long induction where they‟ve been following you all along. Say, “By the way, I do have this.” Then take it away. “It‟s a fantastic thing, just in case you want to treat yourself to something even better.” Don‟t dismiss what I just told you. Do you understand the structure of what I just told you?

Participant:

Yes. I don‟t dismiss it. Basically, I am working on a system that I would like to improve. If I see somebody with the potential to buy in a certain amount and he only buys a specific amount, I would like him to buy to his 263

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

potential because if does enjoy it and shows interest, wouldn‟t it be better to close to show him one or two things then show him a package that contains everything and more to show him a good deal? Lisa:

Ross talked earlier about that other guy who notices something in people that makes them want to come over. Before you make that offer, see if they‟re eager. Are they looking around more? Are they pausing before they get to the cash register? They‟re looking to possibly buy more. Pick up on that if they‟re interested. Is it part of a package? But don‟t do it to everybody.

Ross:

That‟s why she‟s on my team. What she‟s saying is that in the same way your friend or colleague can calibrate people who are going to buy today, maybe you can learn to calibrate to those people who are going to buy more at the last minute. Only make that offer to them.

Participant:

It makes sense, but we didn‟t touch rejection.

Ross:

Before we get to the specific objections you encounter, I talked this morning about pseudo-orientation in time. As a persuader, I never want my client or subject to ever have to make a decision. Instead, I want to take them to the point in time after they‟ve already made the decision and are now enjoying the benefits of having made it. If you do this properly, you are going to cut your objections in half. That said, tell me what the three most common objections are. I‟ll bet one is, “I don‟t need it,” and the other is, “It‟s too expensive.”

Participant:

“I don‟t have money,” “I can‟t afford it,” “I‟m not interested,” “I already have it,” or, “I already have somebody else do my nails.” 264

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

Let‟s back up. “I can‟t afford it.” “I‟m not interested.” “I already have it.” These deal with the overall subject of people having autopilot responses. Have you studied my Speed Seduction® stuff?

Participant:

I just looked at it.

Ross:

Those of you who have studied it know that one of the things I teach is that I seldom take a woman‟s first response as written in stone. It‟s almost always just a reflection of what she‟s thinking, feeling or believing in that moment, and it‟s almost always subject to change. Some of these responses are autopilot, and some of them are real. If you really don‟t need it and truly don‟t want it, you‟re not going to sell them. If they say, “I don‟t need it,” you say, “Of course. The point of indulgence that makes you feel great is not that you need it but that you deserve it.” You can reframe it. Then move on with it. Reframe the meaning. “I can‟t afford it.” The problem is that this sounds too slick. You can joke around. “Do you have a boyfriend who will buy it?” I would say, “I‟ve often thought that myself, right prior to doing something nice for yourself.” Do you hear the I/you shift? We‟re incorporating everything we learned this morning. “I‟ve often thought that myself, right prior to realizing I really want to do something nice for yourself.” Try that. Then move on.

Participant:

What is the motivation of the employees?

265 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

The motivation is that they‟re going to make a lot of money when you teach them this sales process because it‟s a damn good one.

Participant:

In the hard times when it doesn‟t go through?

Ross:

Teach them to reset after they experience the no. We‟ve got to move on to him.

266 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Workshop Candidate: Paul Paul:

I‟m selling rental management property software.

Ross:

I actually have experience with this. My sister has timeshares all over. If I want to go somewhere, I check with my sister to see if I can use her timeshare. Tell me more specifically what this software does. What industry works with the software?

Paul:

It could work for timeshares, condos, commercial real estate or anywhere where there are units, whether they are rental or purchased, as long as there is a monthly charge to the tenants or whoever is being billed.

Ross:

My knowledge of the internet and computers is that I can turn on my Mac and log in to my Twitter account, and that‟s it. What does it do?

Paul:

This would work for you because it takes all of the data and manages it so you don‟t have to do your own calculations or keep track. It keeps track of basically all of your expenses and income.

Ross:

Does it tell you which units are available for rental and what you would rent them out at?

Paul:

Yes. It tells you when people move in and move out and at what prices and tax calculations.

Ross:

What does the package cost? When it comes to a really powerful, important package…

Paul:

I don‟t want to buy that package. 267

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

… that comes with a couple of bonuses.

Paul:

Bonersus?

Ross:

He‟s sharp. What does the package sell for?

Paul:

The average price would be around $600 and up, depending on the number of units.

Ross:

In this market, are you aware of what those things tend to sell for?

Paul:

Up to $10,000. It‟s a very specific kind of software. It‟s custom designed for every client.

Ross:

I‟m not sure I understand. You have a basic structure that you build. Then you go in and say, “Based on this, we can shift it around.”

Paul:

It‟s just a starting business.

Ross:

Do you own the software? Is it yours, or is it someone else‟s?

Paul:

It‟s 50/50.

Ross:

Who do you see as your ideal customer for this?

Paul:

Big property owners, the companies that own more than 10, 20 or 100 buildings or units.

Ross:

You‟re not looking to go to individual building owners. This is not even really a persuasion thing as much as a marketing strategy question.

Paul:

How do I get to the people who make the decision in the company?

Ross:

The first step obviously is identifying who you want to sell it to. Can you identify those people and companies? 268

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Paul:

Yes, we have a list.

Ross:

You already have a process and a strategy. Do they have some kind of an internal sales team or buyers who are responsible for looking for this kind of stuff?

Paul:

That I don‟t know.

Ross:

I have to be honest. This deals with an aspect of doing business that I personally have no expertise in. I don‟t do this. I never claimed to be able to do this. That said, it doesn‟t mean I can‟t assist you in finding out how to do it. You‟ve got this software. You want to know how to get to the gatekeepers.

Paul:

Yes, how to get to the decision makers.

Ross:

Do you want to do this, or do you want to hire people to do this for you?

Paul:

I don‟t know yet. I‟m not clear on that point.

Ross:

Does anybody have any contributions or input? Big Mike, I know what you‟re going to say. “Send them the FedEx package.” Before you go there, what would be his procedure for identifying who the right person is to send that to? Address that, then hit him with the FedEx thing.

Mike:

You want to go to a good list broker. I guarantee that Data Warehouse would have this. A list broker is someone who compiles and has lists of all these people for different industries. You name it, they have it. Data Warehouse is one that I use. I like them.

Paul:

Are they in Canada as well as the U.S.? 269

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

Is this a Canadian-only product or a U.S. product as well?

Paul:

It could be adapted to the U.S. as well.

Mike:

Canada is a small market. I used to live up there for nine years. I think you want to come down and sell down here.

Paul:

No objections to that.

Mike:

I don‟t know who the list broker is up in Canada. I could call some people who could probably give it to me very quickly.

Ross:

Canada is above. The U.S. is b-low me.

Paul:

Don‟t look at me when you say that.

Ross:

You get your loving where you can find it.

Mike:

A list broker will identify them. There are also trade publications for these guys. I guarantee there are. What you‟re looking at is a basic lead gen challenge. It‟s not that difficult. You would get a trade publication and run ads.

Ross:

Where would he find the trade publications? How would he identify them?

Mike:

SRDS, Standard Rate & Data Service. You go to the library. The set costs anywhere from $600 to $3,200. Don‟t bother buying it. Just go to the library.

Ross:

Which category would he search under?

270 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

I would look under “property management.” That would be my start. You‟ll figure it out fast. They list all of the different lists that are available. You‟re trying to get to the gatekeeper. There are two ways to get to the gatekeeper. One way is white paper. It‟s a report. What do you call your software?

Paul:

Rent Management or Unit Management.

Ross:

I manage my unit quite well.

Mike:

“7 Rental Management Secrets Everyone Should Know.” They‟ll send in for the report. You‟ll send it out. There‟s a trick to writing those reports. It‟s got to be really high quality information. Basically, there‟s a turning point. When you write a special report, you want to give really good information. About two-thirds or three-quarters of the way down, there‟s a turning point. Then you go into the close.

Ross:

Let‟s back up a minute. I agree with you, but you‟re jumping ahead, so let‟s slow down and back up a step. Let me translate what he‟s saying at a speed, velocity and volume where you can get clear on it. The first step is to find the entities that you want to get in contact with. You named two resources to go to.

Mike:

Standard Rate & Data Services, SRDS. Data Warehouse, a list broker.

Ross:

What are the categories he would look for? 271

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Mike:

Property owners.

Ross:

This is an idea! I‟m getting a hit. This could be completely wrong, but my intuition says this. My parents, among other things, did real estate sales. My dad was a real estate broker. Maybe if you got in touch with realtors who do commercial property, they could in turn help you identify those people.

Mike:

That would be another way to get in through the back door.

Ross:

I always like to get through the back door rather than the front door.

Paul:

You‟re a perv.

Ross:

Thanks a lot. I‟m here all week.

Paul:

That could be a way, but what would be their motivation? Should I offer them a commission?

Ross:

This is just an idea. I‟ve never thought about this before. They already know these people so they could even bundle the software as part of the deal. Sell the software to them. Then they offer the software as a bonus to people to close the deal. Remember, I said that one model of marketing is that your product is an enabling product to some other product. It makes the experience easier for either the seller or the buyer. It‟s just an idea totally off the top of my head.

Mike:

Then you would have a special report, and that would send them to calling you. Give them just one thing to do. Don‟t give them a bunch of different ways of contacting you. Just rail them on one so they don‟t make a lot of choices. 272

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

The other thing would be a free trial. You would have a website and a free trial. Salesforce is notorious for this. They say, “You can use this for 30 days.” You enter all your data in there, and it starts working. You think, “Shit! I‟ve got all my data in there now, and it‟s working. I kind of like it. Let‟s buy into it.” Ross:

That‟s a good idea. Is there a way to take the software and rig it so you can lock out people at 30 days if they haven‟t paid?

Paul:

Yes, we have that feature already installed.

Mike:

Are you hosting this, or is it going to be an application you‟re going to mail them?

Paul:

It‟s an application.

Mike:

You should host it. I‟ll tell you why, pain of disconnect. Here‟s the issue. Now you have 200 or 300 of these out, and you make an app change. You‟ve got to send them all the updates. When it‟s hosted, all 200 get it immediately as you‟re doing it. The biggest thing is the pain of disconnect. They‟ve got to pay you that monthly continuity on that charge. I would just say, “It‟s $39 a month,” or $200 or $300 up front and so much a month. You want that monthly continuity, and you want it to run forever. Then you don‟t have all these problems with all the little things you have to do with updates. You get them to go onto your system and use it for a 30-day or 60-day free trial. They get to like it, and boom.

Ross:

He just gave you a really good piece, which is the structure of the revenue model. You can do everything else correctly, but if your revenue model doesn‟t work, you‟re up S Creek without a paddle. 273

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Thank you! You‟ve just won free admission to any Speed Seduction® seminar for the next two years, 2009 and 2010. Mike:

I appreciate that. I‟m a married man, but maybe I‟ll get some mistresses.

Ross:

Send your kid. Thank you. It was an extraordinarily good contribution. I acknowledge it.

Paul:

By hosting it, you mean hosting it on a website.

Mike:

You‟ll be hosting a service. That way, it‟s yours. You own it. That would be it. Then you go back to the lead gen. You‟ve got to get them in there. If you have a mailing list, you can just mail them a sales letter. Get somebody to write it. Say, “Come here for 60 days,” and give them normal offers. Get them in there. Definitely do the U.S..

Ross:

I like how you languaged that. Very good. I‟m not making fun of you. You said, “The challenge I had before,” presupposing it‟s no longer there.

Paul:

I hope it‟s no longer there.

Ross:

It‟s not. Can you see it? If you try to see it, it just slips away. You did that very well. Go ahead.

Paul:

The challenge is why should they even consider the software? They‟re managing okay by themselves right now, or they were up until this point.

Ross:

What is it going to do for them?

Paul:

Save time, save cost, and all of that boring stuff. 274

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

It‟s not boring. Saving time and money is not boring.

Paul:

How can I get them excited about that?

Ross:

I don‟t know this field, but I can tell you this. Remember what I said: fears, failures, frustration, desire, dreams, hopes wishes. You have to ask yourself, “What are the fears, failures and frustrations of these people? What are their wants, needs, desires, dreams and wishes?” I don‟t know that. I don‟t know this field. That‟s for you to identify. I‟m not asking you to do it here. We have a month of follow-up call support. Your first assignment is to say, “What is my process going to be for finding these people?” The second assignment is, “What are the fears, failures and frustrations of these people? What are their desires, wants and needs?” You have to identify that. Otherwise, you‟re shooting in the dark.

Charles:

Can this be adopted for running storage units?

Mike:

Sure. Anything that has units and a monthly revenue or monthly expense.

Ross:

The other thing you have to ask is do you want to do the actual selling, or do you want to find someone who is already good at doing that? My own discovery in my business is that the number-one constraint is how to structure the business so that I just do what I love, which is this, teaching, communicating with the students. I want to have everyone else do every other function that I might be good at, but I‟m not excellent at. I only want to do where I‟m excellent. 275

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

It‟s a profoundly smart point to make. Lisa:

I have done some research in real estate. One of the biggest reasons why people buy rental property is for monthly cash flow. What you want to say is, “How would you like to increase your monthly cash flow? I can do that for you. With the time you‟ve saved, you can go out and buy more properties and make even more money.” Cash flow is superbly top.

Ross:

I just had an idea. Have you seen these guys who sell how to buy foreclosures? I know there is someone that has a program, “How to Make Millions in Commercial Real Estate.” You might find those guys and see if you can have them prepurchase the software and they bundle it in as a bonus or offer it in the back of the room. The people who are doing those seminars are raking in the bucks. Have you seen any of those? Adam, are you online? Go to Google and type in “Get rich commercial real estate” and see what we get.

Participant:

Try “colossal cash commercial real estate.”

Ross:

This is a principle in marketing called NEER, Naturally Existing Economic Relationships. What you‟re going to do is be a parasite. You‟re going to latch on to the marketing structure or system that someone has already built rather than trying to build your own marketing structure, which is a hell of an effort. It‟s like putting the milk back in the cow, to use my favorite metaphor. Latch on to someone else‟s so you don‟t have to build it, if there is any way that you can do that. What did you find?

276 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Adam:

There is a book by J. Scott Scheel, Colossal Cash in Commercial Property.

Ross:

Here‟s what you do. Buy his book and CD, because I‟ll bet you dollars to dildos that he‟s got something in the back that offers a seminar.

Participant:

can get on his mailing list and see if he‟ll do a joint venture with you or an endorsed mailing.

Ross:

That‟s a really good idea. We‟re going to save you years of work here.

Participant:

I have one other quick observation. This is just off the cuff. I may be going slightly off tangent. If you want to do coaching for people who want to sell more real estate or you want to have a seminar, get this book, which you should probably read anyway. It‟s Think BIG and Kick Ass in Business and Life by Donald Trump and Bill Zanker. Look in the back. They do this brilliantly. Read the last few pages of the book. You‟ll see how they set up for coaching and consulting and seminars. It‟s brilliant how they do it.

Participant:

It seems like Big Mike and I have been in the business world for a while and always have something to say. Just to clarify something, there will absolutely be lists available. You can just google and find the trade magazines for almost any industry, certainly for apartment management. I happen to be in hotel management. We own and operate mostly Marriott hotels.

Ross:

Would this be applicable to hotels?

277 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Participant:

We‟re talking about what, in the hotel environment, you‟d call a property management system that tracks everything that goes on in the hotel in terms of revenues, not necessarily expenses. Big Mike brought up something key that you want to consider. You do want to have a hosted site rather than selling them a product that you ship them the software. The reason is not only the difficulty of un-engaging, but also that you can upgrade continually. When you talk to a business, they‟re going to say, “What‟s my cost?” If you do a hosted site, there is no capital cost. That‟s very key because there is absolutely no cost to you. You can calculate it on units rented per month. When we take over a hotel, if it‟s not a Marriott, we install a property management system that can be dialed into from anywhere on the internet. The owner can always download their stuff from any property anywhere without having to go out and install it. That also allows you to upgrade and sell the upgrades.

Paul:

I actually had a challenge with this before with one company that is currently using the installed version on their systems. They didn‟t want to put the data up on the server.

Ross:

That‟s was exactly my objection. How do you guarantee the security of their data?

Participant:

Insomuch as banks guarantee your security if you‟re banking online or whatever.

Ross:

It‟s going to be an objection, so you‟d better be ready to handle that. “It‟s triple encrypted by Caltech nerds who never leave their

278 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

basement and live on junk food,” or something like that. I‟m sure the nerds can do anything. Participant:

Salesforce does that. Most of the top Fortune 100 companies use Salesforce and have their entire customer lists there.

Paul:

It was just one company that gave me that objection.

Ross:

It‟s a legitimate objection.

Participant:

I think you can overcome that relatively easily. People know that there are safeguards built in.

Ross:

Do you know how you find out how to handle that? Go on Mozy. Everything on my Mac is backed up on to Mozy. What‟s the other backup service for the PC, where you backup all of your files online?

Participant:

The one I use is Carbonite.

Ross:

Look and see how they guarantee your files are going to be secure. They talk about how it‟s encrypted and no one can get in.

Participant:

Actually, that‟s a sales point. It‟s always backed up, like www.Salesforce.com.

Ross:

What is Salesforce, very quickly?

Participant:

It‟s a sales management tool. This would possibly be great for you Ross. We put all of our salespeople and leads in it. It takes them through the process.

Participant:

They‟re a CRM program, but they‟re missing a few things that I like. I have two programs. 279

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

I would say, for you, this is not a persuasion issue. This is a marketing structure issue. I‟m going to give you a piece of advice. It‟s the single best thing you can do, whether you do it or not I can‟t control. Go to www.StrategicProfits.com, that‟s Rich Schefren, and sign up. He has modules that teach you how to structure a business and how to find the right people to hire. This is a business structure issue. Don‟t try to learn it yourself. Find out from someone who knows how to do it. It‟s $400 a month. It‟s Strategic Profits. He unlocks the modules month-by month. If you‟re willing to pay him, he‟ll unlock all of them, which I suggest you do. Don‟t wait. Pony up the cash. Say, “I want to open all the modules at once. I‟ll pay you the whole thing, not $400 a month.” He has different modules on finding your market to finding your proposition, how to run the business so you can get the right people, how to assign responsibility to employees, and how to create procedures. You‟re talking about running a business, correct? Or do you want to sell the license to the software to someone else?

Paul:

No, I don‟t want to do that.

Ross:

Might it be a better idea?

Paul:

Maybe. I don‟t know.

280 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

Ross:

It might be a better idea. If you sell it and get a big fat fee, then you‟re done, rather than trying to do the marketing and the sales force. Is it saleable?

Paul:

Yes.

Ross:

How would he go about finding people to sell the software to? “You own it now. I‟ve sold it to you. Do what you want with it.” How do you find people to buy the software, not as an end user but they have the rights now and can go sell it to whoever they want.

Participant:

I‟d think you‟d have to have it online for a while and have it proven that it‟s gaining a little bit of momentum.

Ross:

I would do that. It‟s like an author. Does he want to sell the rights to the book, or does he want to go into the publishing business? If I were you I would start out like he said, make it a going concern and then see if you can sell it. Who bought Facebook?

Participant:

It was MySpace, not Facebook, and it was Time Warner [sic] (NewsCorp bought MySpace).

Ross:

Google bought YouTube for how much?

Participant:

$600 million.

Ross:

$600 million is a nice payday. I‟m not suggesting that you get that. For $600 million, I would retire from teaching. I‟d feel awful about it and all those poor guys who can‟t use my system anymore. Sorry boys, but for $600 million, I think I could take a couple of years off. Here‟s the thing I want to warn you about. Commercial real estate is about to collapse. It‟s the next big bubble that‟s going to go pop. I 281

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

don‟t know how that‟s going to affect the sales environment for what you have. Commercial real estate is going to take a huge nosedive in the next 90 days. It‟s already dying. Where I live, in Marina del Rey, they have a huge new building they put up and not one thing is rented. It‟s completely vacant. Builders are losing their shirts. They‟re leveraged into things. Mark my words, in 90 days it‟s going to go right into the toilet. If commercial real estate folds completely, loses half of its value and people are going out of business, is this going to be a good thing or a bad thing to sell? I don‟t know how that would affect it. Lisa:

What he said about the storage units, that‟s still growing. Most people, even if they have to leave someplace, they have to store their property somewhere.

Ross:

That‟s true. It‟s a better market.

Charles:

People I know in the storage business are now buying houses because they‟re so cheap. They‟re buying brand-new houses for $40,000 to $60,000.

Ross:

Look at the realistic conditions of your market. Someone said about the economy, “Things get worse just before they get even worse.” That $1.7 trillion that was injected into the economy, have you seen the bailout? Did you Estonians get that $1.7 trillion? You squirreled it back in Estonia. Have you seen any of it? They way it works is the people who are in the spigot and get the money first get the use of it. When it gets into the system, the inflation is going to go through the roof and more people are going 282

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

to lose everything. I‟m here to tell you, it may be, if you could turn around and target the storage business. Whose idea was that? Paul:

Charles‟s.

Ross:

You‟re a smart guy. I like you. That may be where you should go. That‟s where the market is going to grow. Do you see this room? A year or two years ago, there would have been 100 to 200 people in this room. People just don‟t have the money to travel and go to hotels. They just don‟t want to do it. I would say that‟s a really good idea. Who is your market? I‟d say storage. Go after people who do storage rental. They may have enough of a way of an inventory that they don‟t need to do it, but it‟s an idea. Do you have more?

Paul:

Of the same project? I have others.

Ross:

On this project.

Paul:

It could be adapted to condos. As you said, real estate is collapsing.

Ross:

It‟s going to fall like a falcon with lead pajamas.

Participant:

I have a product that‟s software and hardware that would fit in with your product.

Ross:

What is your product? You‟re like Christopher Lloyd from “Back to the Future.” I say that in a good way. You‟re so brilliant. We were teaching something today about orienting someone in time to make them think that they‟re already in their future, and he said, “Yes, let‟s really take them into the future.” His idea is, “Let‟s 283

Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com

actually do that.” I love it. I love your imagination. This is admiration. Maybe you can talk to him about what you have. What else do you have? I want to close this with a big, fat trance induction with everyone. I want to have the time to do that. Paul:

I was also thinking about another project. I was actually talking to Lisa last night about it. I‟m not sure if it‟s more of a hobby or if people would pay money for it. Basically, I was thinking of taking the concept of videography of events and streaming it over the internet.

Ross:

You showed me that thing where if there‟s a funeral and you can‟t make it to the funeral, we bring the funeral to you, or bring the wedding to you. The way that would work is that you would bring a camera that has an internet connection?

Paul:

With a laptop and 3G connection.

Ross:

What would stop people from just using their webcam and streaming that over Ustream or Stickam? They can already do it.

Paul:

I don‟t know if there is a market for that.

Ross:

I don‟t know.

Paul:

Tell me the truth.

Ross:

No.

Paul:

That settles it.

284 Mindframe Persuasion® Home Study Course Seminar Transcript Copyright  2009, Ghita Services, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Website – http://www.seduction.com