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Hey Vipul, After you learn the 'A-B-C's of driving, I suggest that you practise, at your own pace, the following: 1. Up and down a steep slope, in forward gear, then in reverse gear; 2. Experience how 1st and 2nd gear 'engine braking' works in steep slopes; 3. Learn to make a perfect '8'; 4. Choose a parking slot and reverse *exactly* into the middle of the slot *without* turning back. That is, using your rear-view mirror and both wing mirrors *only*. When you master this technique, your peripheral vision automatically gets honed and you will have fewer dents/ scratches/ accidents on account of you; 5. Repeat #4 at night, in a dimly lit street; 6. Repeat #4 & #5 on a steep slope; 7. Learn 'tight' parallel (kerb-side) and angular parking to perfection, once again, using only your wing and rear-view mirrors; 8. Learn to drive in *any* traffic situation *without* honking; 9. Take your car through very crowded, very narrow market places without honking; 10. Finally, never be afraid of getting a few minor scratches and dents - consider the cost of repair as your learning cost. The more deeply you feel hurt when your car gets 'hurt', the better driver you'll turn out to be! Essentially here is what i thought new drivers should learn first *) Clutch Control - how best to teach this? *) Steering control *) Braking. *) Guaging the car what else? Any tips on how to teach someone to drive?
Hi Wishboneash, Firstly, welcome to the forum. Now as regards to teaching your wife, the most important thing is not to yell as you did so. Just let her drive. Tell her that she has to mantain safe distance from the front car. Do not allow her to cut lanes EVER. Teach her about steady driving, like driving at 45 - 50 in 5th gear without pressing the clutch. Try and get her to follow a cyclist at safe distance in a particular gear for sometime without knocking the vehicle. Slow & steady driving is the most difficult to master. Steering Control : Take her on winding road and make her drive on the left most lane, near the shoulder. Ask her to keep a foot distance from the shoulder, no more, no less. Teach her to keep one eye on the shoulded lane always. Will help her in night driving as well and will teach her to avoid taking the glare of oncoming traffic.
Clutch Control: If she can follow a biker in first gear for some time without knocking, half the battle is one. Most new drivers I have noticed who have not graduated from Fiat/Amby days release the clutch very quickly while changing gears thus giving a jerk. Make sure she counts 5..4..3..2 while releasing the clutch, 5 correspoding to start of release and 2 corresponding to complete release. This count changes based on the gear she is changing from 1st to 2nd --5..4..3..2 2nd to 3rd --5..4..3 3rd to 4th --5..4 4th to 5th --5 Set the interval between these counts based on your vehicle's clutch setting and response. Braking: If she ever brakes without looking at the rear view mirror, remind her of it. That is the most important aspect of breaking for a learner. Then as she gets more experience you can teach her the benifits of breaking using the gears, and pumping brakes. Guaging the Car: While turning the car, left right or U turn, always turn the steering wheel after the driver has crossed the corner object from where you are turning. The main rule while driving is "When you are not sure, you just dont do it". Guaging the car will only come from experience of driving it, so let her drive most of the time. If she stalls in the middle of the road, dont push her into starting quickly like everyone else outside, just be relaxed and help her get out of the situation by re-iterating the rules discussed. Emphasize on SLOW. Change gear SLOWLY, release clutch SLOWLY, but drive STEADILY along with the traffic. Show her that if one drives slower than the traffic, how the cars around cut you left right and center and scare the hell out of you which makes you drive only slower. But if you are up with their speed, traffic around you suddenly feels normal. If you will be patient, she will drive very well and LOVE you more for it too. I believe women are steady drivers and they generally always get a better Fuel Efficiency than their male counterparts. Cheers!!! Burjis
Thats a BIG no-no!! Never press the clutch pedal down while cornering and/or going downhill. And NEVER EVER do this suddenly in the middle of a corner, as it will unbalance your car, at
best making for a jerky ride, and at worst, cause you to spin. What you need to do is engage the correct gear and the correct speed at which you can take a corner BEFORE you enter the corner. once you are turning in, the only action should be with the steering wheel and a constant throttle. This same principle holds true while climbing steep hills/inclines as well. Remember this rule: Always finish you gear changes and braking before the corner. Quote: Originally Posted by [b Quote[/b] ]I'm also aware that you can apply brakes without using the clutch and use gears for in breaking faster, which could do some damage to the gearbox as well. Yes, you most definately can apply the brakes without pressing the clutch. This is the best way, causing the least disturbance to your car while its in motion. As far as shifting down while decelerating, this is esstential once you start driving faster. However, to do this without causing excesive driveline lash, its best to blip the throttle to match the revvs when shifting down. I guggest you start with the basics first, as described above, and then move onto this. Once you become good at this, you will instantly feel the different in taking corners...suddenly, you can take 'em much faster! Plus, its just a great feeling to downshift into a corner, braking late and matching the revs perfectly...gives me goosebumps just talking about it!
f you brake while in gear, without leaving the clutch, you will get much better braking and put a lot less strain on your brakes, keeping them cooler and making them last longer. However, better than staying in gear while braking is downshifting before braking. Say you are at 50km/h in 5th gear and u need to break, you can brake and downshift to 3rd gear at that speed with ease. Just make sure that you dont downshift to too low a gear that will cause the engine to revv too high which can be bad. Instead you can keep downshifting while braking, (as our friend SG says, he goes from 6th to 5th to 4th to 3th to 2nd to 1st then nuttral
Also, as rtech says Always finish you gear changes and braking before the corner, and keep a constant throttle through the corner., that is one way of doing it, but personally i finish the braking before the corner in normal driving, but then i still keep my foot on the brakes through the corner without actually applying any pressure, because in traffic it is quite common to come to a sudden stop in the middle of a corner, or to stop for pedestrians who could not see you approaching from around the corner..etc etc... so this reduces reaction time.
Engine braking (using the gearbox and engine for breaking) is not considered bad at all... sure maybe it reduces the life of your gearbox by a couple of k-kms, and maybe you have to replace your clutch at 67kkm instead of 70k-km, but it extends the life of your brakepads by 6k-kms and decreases your stopping distance which is priceless as an extra 2meters of braking distance can make the difference between life or death. (all the above "km & m" figures being very rough estimates)
1 point though..... say I am going at 100km/h in the 5th... and have to brake to almost stop (not talking about emergency braking), I'd brake till almost the 5th gear's bottom i.e. 30-40km/h then press the clutch and stop. I won't ever go below the 1000rpm mark in the gear ... as that'll do more damage to engine than any good to the brake pads. Well in Emergency braking... I have never got time to press the clutch... its a reflex braking and..... I don't remember the clutch then. And say if u brake too hard... u lock your wheels (or maybe slow them down to 2km/h), and if u r in a gear then the engine stalls. (then u can do a lot more damage) Best Approach : when speed goes below the limit of the gear either shift to lower gear (if u'll still be rolling) or press the clutch (if u have to completely stop) lower limit is normally 30-35km/h (of the highest gear), so I guess u can always stop from that speed without engine braking. Are you talking about A/T or M/T. Coz in M/T you can manually shift down to 1st provided you don't over revv it. When i'm doing 100kmph and i need to brake hard. I shift into 3rd, slow down then 2nd slow down and then finally 1st and keep the clutch pressed when the car stops. Remember, higher the revs, more the engine braking. But never ever over rev your engine. It always helps to know upto what speed each gear goes. Engine braking is used when you need to brake from high speeds within a small distance. For normal sedate driving, i wouldn't really need to engine brake. Regards.. Shan2nuLet me just say once again i am going to simplfy all the processes so the concept can be clearly understood. Lets say we have 4 main rotating parts
1 - Clutch 2 - Input axle to gear box (between clutch and gearbox) 3 - Output axle from gearbox 4 - the actual gear selector cog(s) (this is the simplified part). When u select a gear all you are doing is moving this "part" around, allowing it to make contact with different gears of different sizes, hence giving different gear ratios. This is a diagram (just try and realize that the opening on the TOP where the gearlever is connected is connected to a lever in the gearbox that moves around the "moving part"
Lets do a hypothetical upshift from 1st to 2nd without doubleclutching (in a car with a syncromeshed gearbox -ie any car in the last 10++ years) You are in 1st gear, the engine is at 5,000Rpm, you press the clutch and almost simultaneously release the accelerator. Shift the gearstick into Neutral, and then continue to push it into second. (where the engine will only be revving at 2,500Rpm) (Now the part that u are shifting in the gearbox was spinning really fast when u were in first and is still freewheeling very fast in neutral, so when u are pushing into 2nd this is where a syncro comes in....it is like a mini-clutch or think of it as a "Cushion" on the gear that basically gets the moveable peice spinning at the same speed so that when you push into 2nd gear it slides in without any problem. Hope that was clear! If you got that it should be quite simple to understand double clutching now - (remember u want to double clutch when there are no syncros) ok, so you are doing the same 1st to 2nd upshift using dblcltching.. You are in 1st gear, the engine is at 5,000Rpm, you press the clutch and almost simultaneously release the accelerator. Shift the gearstick into Neutral, and THEN RELEASE THE CLUTCH (this completes 1 "clutching"). By releasing the clutch and having stepped off the accelerator, now the engine is spinning at 2,500rpm which is similar to what is will be revving at in 2nd gear at this speed (u are controlling engine revs).
Since the clutch is not pressed and the car is in neutral the "moveable peice" spins at a speed relative to that of the engine. then PRESS THE CLUTCH AGAIN (2nd clutching) and continue to push it into second. (where the engine will only be revving at 2,500Rpm, which is the speed that the "moveable peice" is aldready spinning at! Thats basically the basics of it! As you can now see...double clutching in modern cars is just a waste of time (i cant think of a reason to.....) except sometimes when u are going a bit fast in 2nd and u try and put the car in 1st and it doesnt slot in (i assume u guys know what i am talking abt?) then u just leave it in neutral..leave the clutch...revv the engine...press the clutch and it slots straight into 1st!..there...you just double clutched. I guess in this scenario the syncros were just having a hard time bringing the "moving peice" up to speed?? Im sorry i didnt explain the way the gearbox works in any detail..but it is complicated...so find a good site with pics and.wait...here..this seems to be a great one.....Howstuffworks "How Manual Transmissions Work" check out the whole site...you will learn a lot...and they have some awesomely helpful flash animations to explain things. Gearbox's are truly amazing peices of engineering! just try in your mind to create one...even if you aldready know how they work and its still incredibly tough! cheers..... Rehaan. But in a very slow moving traffic, your one leg is almost all the times on the clutch pedal even in first gear, because u never know when u have to apply the brakes. And thus half or full pressing it based on the speed. So I feel then it is better to drive in second with only controlling the clutch, which may cause a bit more wear n tear(which may be negligible.) but u can drive more comfortabllly and at the same time save fuel. use the clutch pedal only to change gears. the only other time that you may use the clutch is sither during half clutch on slopes or when you start from dead stop. use the appropriate gear to drive in and never ride your clutch. irst of all trying to slow down from 100kph only using ur brakes is a not such a great idea.as after sometime ,the brakes will get heated up and cud lose their efficiency.so u cud use engine braking if its not an emergency stop. like say if u r approaching a toll booth at 100-120kph ,u can lift off the throttle and then shift to 4th from 5th.and at the same time pump ur brakes.in this way u can warn others behind u of ur intentions .and then when the rpm falls below 2500-2000 maybe u can downshift to the next lower gear.in this way u can use engine braking and not lose control also .
but if its an emergency stop then u have to brake . now for when to change gears so that the engine does not stall....[b]when u dont want to accelerate u can shift from 5 th to maybe 3rd or 4th and wait till the engine is about to stall i.e when the rpm is abt 1000 but the car is rolling due to inertia. and then shift to the appropriate gear. but if u want to gain speed and u have shifted from 5th to 4th ,then maybe u have to change to a lower 3rd or 2nd gear to accelerate.
Even if you try to accelerate in lower gear, the engine RPM can not increase proportional to the throttle position. Reason being that the engine does not provide enough torque at wheels in 4/5 gear. (With lesser load, it might be able to pull through). This will result in fuel rich mixture supplied to the engine, effectively screwing up the ignition timing. One has to shift to lower gear to accelerate in this case or, do what most truck drivers do. Hit the clutch and disengage engine, let the engine gain higher RPM, engage it. It will be able to accelerate again. Well A familiar problem!! When I taught my wife driving I tanked up and told her that I will teach only for one week or till the full tank of fuel finishes , Whichever comes first!!! She learnt in 5 days. It helped that she was interested. before starting I gave her two theory classes on the board at home explaining how the engine power is transferred to wheels and why it is important to change gears. Also told her about momentum and the correlation of speed, momentum and gears. Then made her do lot of dry runs of changing gears and presseing the correct pedals, most important being the Brake pedal. I told her to keep looking staright and press brake pedal whenever I shouted brake while the car was stationary. My shouting while the car was stationary got her used to my shouting in the car while teaching and helped her overcome the sudden panic one feels. It also made me confident that at least she, the car and the others on the road will be safe when required. (Common mistake by learners is to press accelerator when in panic , instead of brake). then I started with her in an open ground, helped her in initial pick up and let her drive around subsequently whichever way she felt fit. Initiallly she did not want to change gears, but from second day onwards i insisted on changing gears. Like this we went on fighting and cursing each others, but smiling briefly to hide the storm brewing inside the car(of the verbal kind) , at passing acquaintainces who used to go on evening walks on the same road. By fifth day she was driving on her own. I also told her to initially use a lot of horn so that at least others know that an unguided missile is approaching them and take evasive action. Subsequently she improved her skills by driving for small didtances regularly and now she confidently drives on hill roads. It is important that the lady in question drives regularly to keep her confidence levels up and hone her skill. She also should have some motive to drive. Otherwise generally females as a gender like to avoid any technically sounding activity. They are more interested in functionality than tech babble. For most of them the car is a means to get from place A to B and if it can be done withput changing any gear then why bother with such stupid things as X RPM for Ist gear and such like. Hope this helps. Happy Teaching P.S. Always remember who is the Boss while teaching! LOL
Hi, Have been going to driving classes and simultenously practicing it on my 800. I need some suggestions/clarifications to learn a good (read better) habit. This is how I start the vehicle: a.)[FONT="] [/FONT]Cold start/normal start: Check for neutral, if geared ,slot into neutral. Depress acc. Pedal fully 3-4 times(to clear any gasoline in cylinder- read somewhere , may not make sense for cold start but I still do it). Then start the engine with one fine and quick turn of key(1-3secs), pull and release choke( mine is a carb 800) knob 2- 3 times to maintain the idling. After idling for 2-3 minutes, slot into first gear and slowly release clutch – at one point the car starts forward , then release clutch fully and car continues to move(works on any near flat surface- I mean car moves without any accelerator push at all).But user manual reads that while releasing clutch , when you hear a change in engine sound , give some accltr push to keep it running smooth, then car starts smoothly forward. But practically this kind of hearing to engine is very difficult to me , most of the time I end up doing it abruptly or very delayed and end result is a stall with a jerk. So, these days I am just allowing it to roll without accl at all and then after a few meters,if needed I will accelerate or else if it’s a incline down then slotting into 2nd and releasing clutch slowly will keep the vehicle moving in 2nd.( many times I had moved into 2nd gear without accelerating at all, is it bad??)(I mean is it a must that engine should be revving to change gear?) Of course , many times while doing this kind of slow clutch release , car just jerks and stalls(if clutch release is not smooth- am still learning you see), so are such frequent jerking and staling because of insufficient engine speed harmful to either clutch/engine?? Ofcourse once am some weeks experienced, I may not do that, but just want to know.
b.)Now, if it is an incline up, it is then that I face problem. I will depress clutch fully and then when say like about 1/10 of clutch is yet to be released I push accl pedal, some times it works but if incline is more steeper, I have to rev more before fully releasing clutch. Now my worry is , will revving engine while clutch is still engaged cause clutch wear. c.) At driving school, when the road is potholed or at speed breakers, they instruct to depress clutch fully and coast in 2nd gear . clutch need to be released only when movement is too slow. Well, personally I think this causes more clutch wear- holding clutch fully down while engine/vehicle is running, doesn’t it? d.) in similar situations what I do is, shift to 1st gear and slowly coast along with clutch released and no pumping on gas pedal. Only when some force is needed I will push accl/gas pedal. I feel this is more sensible, is not it? Though coasting in first gear may mean more fuel consumption, I think it is good to engine and clutch , is it not so? e.) the user manual suggests that engine should be started with clutch fully depressed, but some times (when in neutral) I do start without using clutch. I think its ok because , using clutch is needed if vehicle is in gear only, am I right? d.) also when going down a steep incline i almost always use engine breaking ( i use 1st or 2nd gear as the case may be) and only if neccesary i will use foot brake. So , in long run will such engine breaking
ruin the engine/gear box?( see they will be strained to hold back the vehicle )
b.)Now, if it is an incline up, it is then that I face problem. I will depress clutch fully and then when say like about 1/10 of clutch is yet to be released I push accl pedal, some times it works but if incline is more steeper, I have to rev more before fully releasing clutch. Now my worry is , will revving engine while clutch is still engaged cause clutch wear. c.) At driving school, when the road is potholed or at speed breakers, they instruct to depress clutch fully and coast in 2nd gear . clutch need to be released only when movement is too slow. Well, personally I think this causes more clutch wear- holding clutch fully down while engine/vehicle is running, doesn’t it? d.) in similar situations what I do is, shift to 1st gear and slowly coast along with clutch released and no pumping on gas pedal. Only when some force is needed I will push accl/gas pedal. I feel this is more sensible, is not it? Though coasting in first gear may mean more fuel consumption, I think it is good to engine and clutch , is it not so? e.) the user manual suggests that engine should be started with clutch fully depressed, but some times (when in neutral) I do start without using clutch. I think its ok because , using clutch is needed if vehicle is in gear only, am I right? f.) also when going down a steep incline i almost always use engine breaking ( i use 1st or 2nd gear as the case may be) and only if neccesary i will use foot brake. So , in long run will such engine breaking ruin the engine/gear box?( see they will be strained to hold back the vehicle )
So, please advice me regarding my questions / errors . p.s have searched in this section and found some threads on identifying clutch wear but couldnot figure exact answers to my worries-so has to post a new thread, is the information is already available in some other thread, pardon me and post the link please.[/quote] Answers to your queries: b. No c.Control acceleration and use clutch only when speed goes down quite low(so low that the vehicle might stall).Yes,clutch would wear out if the clutch is depressed with engine running d.correct e. The load on the engine is least if you depress the clutch,even with gear in neutral.So a cold start is always recommended with gear in neutral,handbrake on and clutch depressed. f.Good practice..no damage to engine or gear box To sum up,use the clutch only when needed viz.to prevent engine from stalling in gear,to change gears.Whenever you have to slow down,decelerate and shift to lower gears gradually(use the engine
power to brake) and then brake as necessary. Happy Driving.Ask for more tips if required. he movement of the vehicle, when the clutch is releases (without any acceleration given) is dependent on the power (torque) of the vehicle and how much of it is required to move from its current position. On level ground, most vehicles will move without acceleration given. But on up-slopes, the engine must be able to pull itself, at the idling RPM, up that slope. This is where diesel engines will perform better than petrol ones. Example being, my house parking come out to a sloped road. I can get my Alto out to the road (from the parking spot) without acceleration. But to move up the slope I have to give acceleration. Whereas, the neighbors Indica moves up the slope without any acceleration. Would suggest all not to experiment with this; do not take too long to release the clutch. Releasing cautiously and slowly might not be the best thing, since the situation is similar to riding clutch, for some time. Try to get the foot completely off the clutch and the vehicle moving at the earliest.